Comments on: Have Faith or Pandemonium/Liable to Walk Upon the Scene http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/ Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made Sun, 12 Feb 2012 21:53:32 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Alaska Jack http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37306 Alaska Jack Fri, 06 Aug 2004 00:54:50 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37306 Crooked Timber always surprises me. Given the supposedly high-level tone of this weblog, the authors say a remarkable number of stupid things. The Volokh Conspiracy they ain't. Re Waring's comments, just an observation: If you have to egregiously distort someone's argument in order argue against it, then maybe they have a point after all. I mean, really -- kittens? Just something to consider. - Alaska Jack Crooked Timber always surprises me. Given the supposedly high-level tone of this weblog, the authors say a remarkable number of stupid things. The Volokh Conspiracy they ain’t. Re Waring’s comments, just an observation: If you have to egregiously distort someone’s argument in order argue against it, then maybe they have a point after all. I mean, really—kittens? Just something to consider. – Alaska Jack

]]> By: Morgoth http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37305 Morgoth Thu, 05 Aug 2004 18:47:12 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37305 Get back to Valinor, Illuvatar. Why is it when the leftist paradigm is questioned for the sham it is, that it's always "trollish" or indeed, that other favourite, "racist"? It is a serious quesiton: why exactly was the liberation of Iraqi "illegal"? Get back to Valinor, Illuvatar. Why is it when the leftist paradigm is questioned for the sham it is, that it’s always “trollish” or indeed, that other favourite, “racist”? It is a serious quesiton: why exactly was the liberation of Iraqi “illegal”?

]]> By: ebarrett http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37304 ebarrett Thu, 05 Aug 2004 00:52:16 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37304 andrew boucher wrote: "I suppose this answers the question whether jroth is young or not." >Abner Louima- 1997 >Anthony Baez- 1994 >Nathaniel Levi Gaines, Jr, -1996 >William Whitfield- 1997 >Antonio Rosario- 1995 >Hilton Vega- 1995 All in New York City alone- now that's ancient history for you. andrew boucher wrote: “I suppose this answers the question whether jroth is young or not.” >Abner Louima- 1997 >Anthony Baez- 1994 >Nathaniel Levi Gaines, Jr, 1996 >William Whitfield 1997 >Antonio Rosario- 1995 >Hilton Vega- 1995 All in New York City alone- now that’s ancient history for you.

]]> By: Illuvatar http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37303 Illuvatar Wed, 04 Aug 2004 18:58:19 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37303 Morgoth wrote: "The question is serious:" And yet your posts are utterly ludicrous. This thread is about the media coverage of the events in Iraq--what do you think you are doing, besides trolling? Morgoth wrote: “The question is serious:” And yet your posts are utterly ludicrous. This thread is about the media coverage of the events in Iraq—what do you think you are doing, besides trolling?

]]> By: Anon Kitten http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37302 Anon Kitten Wed, 04 Aug 2004 10:07:40 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37302 Well http://www.erinoconnor.org/movabletype/mt-comments.cgi?entry_id=991 is a great link discussing catty things that are good news to some. Well http://www.erinoconnor.org/movabletype/mt-comments.cgi?entry_id=991 is a great link discussing catty things that are good news to some.

]]> By: anonymusrex http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37301 anonymusrex Wed, 04 Aug 2004 08:12:58 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37301 meow? meow?

]]> By: carlos http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37300 carlos Wed, 04 Aug 2004 01:46:39 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37300 <blockquote>I have only one response to that. Which is a) laughter and b) disgust.</blockquote> I have only two responses to that: ROTFL! Really, who is this? Faf? Gib? Al? The Editors? Great parody, whoever it is. C.
I have only one response to that. Which is a) laughter and b) disgust.
I have only two responses to that: ROTFL! Really, who is this? Faf? Gib? Al? The Editors? Great parody, whoever it is. C.

]]> By: Morgoth http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37299 Morgoth Tue, 03 Aug 2004 23:19:41 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37299 <i>please don’t assume that content-free trolling is tolerated here.</i> Guess that rules out 90% of the anti-war movement then. The question is serious: How *exactly* was the invasion illegal? Given one person's rather vague answer of the Geneva convention, where does that put folks like Switzerland or Taiwan, who aren't part of the UN. Are they similarily illegal as well? And if we assume the field of action was covered by UN hegemony, then under the terms of the Gulf War I ceasefire, which Saddam broke, action was *legal*. And as for folks calling the war "immoral" - I have only one response to that. Which is a) laughter and b) disgust. Saddam Hussein had jails for toddlers, for feck's sake. please don’t assume that content-free trolling is tolerated here. Guess that rules out 90% of the anti-war movement then. The question is serious: How exactly was the invasion illegal? Given one person’s rather vague answer of the Geneva convention, where does that put folks like Switzerland or Taiwan, who aren’t part of the UN. Are they similarily illegal as well? And if we assume the field of action was covered by UN hegemony, then under the terms of the Gulf War I ceasefire, which Saddam broke, action was legal. And as for folks calling the war “immoral” – I have only one response to that. Which is a) laughter and b) disgust. Saddam Hussein had jails for toddlers, for feck’s sake.

]]> By: Mario http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37298 Mario Tue, 03 Aug 2004 22:20:20 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37298 Well, unless you believe all bombing and attacks are being conducted by non-Iraqis then the continuing violence might be a sign that a lot of Iraqis have different vision of what "stepping forth and taking steps to restore their country” means. To some, it seems to mean getting rid of the Americans and the government that they have installed. Of course, if all these Iraqis are "stepping forth and taking steps to restore their country” then why do we 170,000 troops stationed in Iraq? My guess is that we know if we pulled our troops out the current government would quickly be slaughtered by these civic-minded Iraqis and a civil war would likely break out. This has been true since the occupation began and has not changed one iota since then. Once there is government capable of sustaining itself and we can pull American troops out, terrorist bombing in Iraq will cease to huge issue though they will likely continue to make the news. Don't laugh, it could happen in Bird Dog's lifetime. Well, unless you believe all bombing and attacks are being conducted by non-Iraqis then the continuing violence might be a sign that a lot of Iraqis have different vision of what “stepping forth and taking steps to restore their country” means. To some, it seems to mean getting rid of the Americans and the government that they have installed. Of course, if all these Iraqis are “stepping forth and taking steps to restore their country” then why do we 170,000 troops stationed in Iraq? My guess is that we know if we pulled our troops out the current government would quickly be slaughtered by these civic-minded Iraqis and a civil war would likely break out. This has been true since the occupation began and has not changed one iota since then. Once there is government capable of sustaining itself and we can pull American troops out, terrorist bombing in Iraq will cease to huge issue though they will likely continue to make the news. Don’t laugh, it could happen in Bird Dog’s lifetime.

]]> By: Andrew Boucher http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37297 Andrew Boucher Tue, 03 Aug 2004 21:43:08 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37297 "I suppose this answers the question of whether andrew boucher is a black American or not." That's almost like concluding, because I think the priesthood is an honorable calling, that Andrew Boucher was never a small boy. steelworkers of Homestead ==> 1892 !! autoworkers of Flint ==> 1936-37 Hobo's Lullabye ==> yes, well, the word "Hobos" was (I believe) last in current use in the 1930s I suppose this answers the question whether jroth is young or not. “I suppose this answers the question of whether andrew boucher is a black American or not.” That’s almost like concluding, because I think the priesthood is an honorable calling, that Andrew Boucher was never a small boy. steelworkers of Homestead > 1892 !! autoworkers of Flint > 1936-37 Hobo’s Lullabye ==> yes, well, the word “Hobos” was (I believe) last in current use in the 1930s I suppose this answers the question whether jroth is young or not.

]]> By: Adam Kotsko http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37296 Adam Kotsko Tue, 03 Aug 2004 20:12:17 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37296 I think that most people on the right are basically postmodernists at this point -- there is no possible access to the "objective situation" (the illusion of objectivity is just a reification of the liberal media hegemony that discursively enacts its faux "consensus"), so anything that reflects poorly on their political position can only be motivated by the reporter/pundit's personal biases. To the claim that President Bush did something that had negative results for some people, the instinctive reaction is not to assess the facts, but to say, "Oh, I see, more Bush-bashing... We've heard this before." I think that most people on the right are basically postmodernists at this point—there is no possible access to the “objective situation” (the illusion of objectivity is just a reification of the liberal media hegemony that discursively enacts its faux “consensus”), so anything that reflects poorly on their political position can only be motivated by the reporter/pundit’s personal biases. To the claim that President Bush did something that had negative results for some people, the instinctive reaction is not to assess the facts, but to say, “Oh, I see, more Bush-bashing… We’ve heard this before.”

]]> By: Lance Boyle http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37295 Lance Boyle Tue, 03 Aug 2004 19:40:58 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37295 Morality creates law. Not the other way round. You can have one without the other. People lose sight of that fairly easily. The death zone around al-Sadr's home is more "newsworthy" in the sense that its repercussions will have a greater effect on the world even than the chruch bombings. But it's apparent that concentrating on the news as delivered, as though it comes free of agendae, or that it can be easily interpreted, is more important than any discussion of what's actually happening, in Iraq, or now beginning to unfold in northern Africa. Saying it's about oil is like saying it's about money; it is but then it isn't. It's about power, and time. Survival and breeding rights. Immortality and manipulation. On the ground of course it's about avoiding being blown to smithereens. Morality creates law. Not the other way round. You can have one without the other. People lose sight of that fairly easily. The death zone around al-Sadr’s home is more “newsworthy” in the sense that its repercussions will have a greater effect on the world even than the chruch bombings. But it’s apparent that concentrating on the news as delivered, as though it comes free of agendae, or that it can be easily interpreted, is more important than any discussion of what’s actually happening, in Iraq, or now beginning to unfold in northern Africa. Saying it’s about oil is like saying it’s about money; it is but then it isn’t. It’s about power, and time. Survival and breeding rights. Immortality and manipulation. On the ground of course it’s about avoiding being blown to smithereens.

]]> By: dsquared http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37294 dsquared Tue, 03 Aug 2004 19:02:39 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37294 Morgoth: please don't assume that content-free trolling is tolerated here. Morgoth: please don’t assume that content-free trolling is tolerated here.

]]> By: JRoth http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37293 JRoth Tue, 03 Aug 2004 18:17:07 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37293 I suppose this answers the question of whether andrew boucher is a black American or not. If you're <a href="http://www.kmf.org/gammage/">Jonny Gammage</a>, would you be calling on the police without equivocation? If you're Emmit Till, would you be comforted by the arrival of the police? How about Abner Louima and Amadou Diallo? Of course, it's not just race that has divided American police from those they supposedly "serve and protect." Ask the steelworkers of Homestead, or the autoworkers of Flint whom the police serve. Recall the Hobo's Lullabye, which assures us that "when you die and go to heaven, there'll be no policeman there." When I was 8, I too was certain that every cop was a hero. I've grown up a bit since then. I suppose this answers the question of whether andrew boucher is a black American or not. If you’re Jonny Gammage, would you be calling on the police without equivocation? If you’re Emmit Till, would you be comforted by the arrival of the police? How about Abner Louima and Amadou Diallo? Of course, it’s not just race that has divided American police from those they supposedly “serve and protect.” Ask the steelworkers of Homestead, or the autoworkers of Flint whom the police serve. Recall the Hobo’s Lullabye, which assures us that “when you die and go to heaven, there’ll be no policeman there.” When I was 8, I too was certain that every cop was a hero. I’ve grown up a bit since then.

]]> By: allawi http://crookedtimber.org/2004/08/03/have-faith-or-pandemoniumliable-to-walk-upon-the-scene/comment-page-1/#comment-37292 allawi Tue, 03 Aug 2004 18:01:27 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/wp/?p=1966#comment-37292 i happen to hate kittens. they deserve worse than death. in fact, let's see how they like a bullet to the head. very good, sir. things are getting better. i happen to hate kittens. they deserve worse than death. in fact, let’s see how they like a bullet to the head. very good, sir. things are getting better.

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