Comments on: Debating comprehensives

By: Ray

Ray — Mon, 30 Aug 2004 09:38:21 +0000

“the differences in ability between the top 20% and the bottom 20% of the students was so vast that teaching all students in the same room in an effective manner was impossible” The idea is not necessarily that all students of all abilities be in the same class, just that they be in the same school. You can have a comprehensive school that includes different academic streams.

By: will

will — Mon, 30 Aug 2004 03:32:31 +0000

So it’s safe to say that, high schools of science and such aside, US public education is dominated by comprehensives?

By: Dirk Jenter

Dirk Jenter — Fri, 27 Aug 2004 17:03:33 +0000

I would be quite interested in hearing the opinions of the Timberites on Comprehensives – should they exist, do they work, what is necessary to make them work? My own experience attending a Comprehensive for two years in Germany (“Integrierte Gesamtschule”) was an unmitigated disaster, mostly because the differences in ability (defined here as ability to do the work in school) between the top 20% and the bottom 20% of the students was so vast that teaching all students in the same room in an effective manner was impossible. The level of instruction inevitably drifted towards the bottom end, with the unsurprising result that all the high-ability pupils left for selective schools. And the rather serious behavioral issues of some of the students from the weaker end of the spectrum certainly increased my and others motivation to get out. Or, to put it more bluntly, antisocial 11-year olds with knives are very seriously scary.

By: Chris Bertram

Chris Bertram — Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:00:22 +0000

I must admit to being a bit puzzled as to what a “comprehensive” is. Is it just a single public school serving a given catchment area, as is the norm in most countries I know of ? Yes, roughly, I’d say. To be genuinely comprehensive it has to contain a mix of children that reflects the mix in the neighbourhood. Which doesn’t happen if (a) the smart kids are creamed off into a separate school (old Grammar/2ndary mod divide) or (b) the rich kids are creamed off leaving the poorer ones behind. So all abilities and all classes, with streaming within being a different issue.

By: John Quiggin

John Quiggin — Fri, 27 Aug 2004 14:00:23 +0000

I must admit to being a bit puzzled as to what a “comprehensive” is. Is it just a single public school serving a given catchment area, as is the norm in most countries I know of ? Or is there some more specific requirement, such as no streaming of students within subjects by ability or difficulty level. (I’m aware of relatively recent movements to relax residential requirements for enrolments, but this is a side issue I think)

By: Chris Bertram

Chris Bertram — Fri, 27 Aug 2004 11:36:36 +0000

Those perplexed by dsquared’s question, will find an explanation for it here href=”http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/2372081.stm” rel=”nofollow”>http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/2372081.stm .

By: dsquared

dsquared — Fri, 27 Aug 2004 11:27:08 +0000

Does either of them call the other a “nutter”?