Comments on: Who lets foreigners vote?

By: andrew smart

andrew smart — Sun, 24 Oct 2004 15:53:36 +0000

we are a group of americans living in malmö, sweden. for our absentee ballots, we are letting all non-americans decide who we vote for. we have made ballots and have distributed them on different occasions. we have collected around 200 votes.

By: james

james — Thu, 21 Oct 2004 20:11:38 +0000

From a US citizen’s perspective. The “sin” the US committed in Iraq is not one of getting involved in another countries affairs. The US is asked to do that all the time. Its not even one of sending troops to another country. The US is asked to do that frequently. The “sin” is the failing to act with out the consent of the more vocal members of the European community.

By: Demetrius

Demetrius — Thu, 21 Oct 2004 14:56:10 +0000

“…these Americans think nothing of invading other countries for no good reason, stealing their resources,…” I have to admit I found your whole passage funny, roger. Having said that, I have no doubt that the Americans will get tired of all this. They’re not an imperial people, when it comes right down to it. For the sake of their domestic peace and quiet, I suspect that in future they’ll be developing their own resources, looking into alternatives to petroleum, and willing to buy from Satan himself to make up the remainder needed. I do have sympathy for Yanks, though. I LIKE them. That’s why I think that after a bit of economic pain, they’ll come out allright taking this course. Not so the Islamic world… With the removal of the Americans and their allies from the equation, the Dar al-Islam can commence with its interrupted Dark Ages: pogroms, genocide, collapse… As I’ve said before, I LIKE Americans. That’s why I’d prefer to see that part of the world go down the toilet without dragging them with it.

By: HP

HP — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 22:28:55 +0000

the decisions of the rest of the world affected the US therefore America should have a say in the affairs of the rest of the World Ah, but America does have a say in the affairs of the rest of the world, thanks to the CIA and the U.S. military. You know, between Pinochet, the Shah, Saddam (in), Saddam (out), Duvulier (in), Duvulier (out), Noriega (in), Noriega (out), etc., etc., I’ve just about become convinced that no government rules without the implied consent of the U.S. Department of State.

By: james

james — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 21:13:50 +0000

The US did not ratify the Kyoto Accord. Attempting to enforce or otherwise imply the application of a treaty not ratified by the US is precisely the type of action that angers US citizens. Concerning the Kyoto Accord specificly. The US objected to 3rd world exceptions, inabilty of the treaty to effect change, and special case treatement for the EU.

By: roger

roger — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 18:14:34 +0000

The reaction of anger and insult to the Guardian’s suggestion is interesting when you think of the wider world stage right now. Americans don’t want foreigners to even think of telling them how to vote, while at thes same time these Americans think nothing of invading other countries for no good reason, stealing their resources, and—although knowing nothing of their history, culture and language—feeling very self righteous as they order about, with imperturbable sang-froid and stupidity, the natives. Shockingly enough, instead of acknowledging their racial and cultural inferiority and being forever grateful to the great white American bwanas, the Iraqis actually take pot shots at em. The gall of some people!

By: Michael Otsuka

Michael Otsuka — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 18:11:43 +0000

Demetrius: I don’t think it unreasonable to regard US emissions in excess of the Kyoto Accord as a tax it is imposing on the rest of the world.

By: Demetrius

Demetrius — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 17:28:48 +0000

“Isn’t it enough that foreigners bear the cost of greenhouse gasses which Americans pump into the atmosphere? Have they got to pay US taxes too?” Unless the rest of the world has discovered and put into use an entirely new and completely non-polluting industrial powersource, I don’t see that this oh-so-ideologically-correct riposte makes much sense, Michael. The last I looked, Europe and Japan produced quite a fair bit of greenhouse gasses. My own country, Canada, is also a massive producer of pollution as well, Kyoto Treaty support window-dressing to the contrary. Never mind the massive and increasing amounts of pollution produced my developing industrial states like Mexico, Brazil, India, China, etc. etc…. Your response also ignores the fact that a fair bit of the world economy is supported by the US industrial growth. They don’t produce pollution just to spite you, you know. Nice ideological models may be comforting and bring a false clarity, but they’re woefully inadequate for addressing problems in the messy real world.

By: Mark

Mark — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 16:50:53 +0000

As a resident alien of the US for a number of years, I’d like to add a snarky comment. 1. Resident aliens tend to know more about US politics than citizens (probably because they bring their interest with them when they move here). Case in point – a non-representitive poll taken last week of 6 people who work in my office showed that 0% of US citizens were able to name either the white house chief of staff or the house majority leader (including 2 confirmed Republicans), while 100% of resident aliens were able to name both correctly. 2. If they were allowed to vote, resident aliens would be an informed voting bloc. 3. Informed voting blocs are not welcome in the USA.

By: Erik

Erik — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 14:17:07 +0000

One of my former students David Earnest wrote a dissertation on the topic. Many democracies have some possibility for resident aliens to vote but countries differ greatly in the extent to which this is discriminatory (e.g. only nationals of former colonies/EU), whether local jurisdictions have discretion (as in the U.S.) and whether the possibility only exists for local/national elections.

By: Michael Otsuka

Michael Otsuka — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 09:13:46 +0000

If foreigners are willing to pay American taxes, let them vote. No representation without taxation. Isn’t it enough that foreigners bear the cost of greenhouse gasses which Americans pump into the atmosphere? Have they got to pay US taxes too? Incidentally, I pay my taxes to the United Kingdom rather than the USA, but I’m entitled to a vote in US but not UK elections.

By: Sharon

Sharon — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 08:48:32 +0000

Well, it’s a better song than the damned British national anthem. And speaking as a regular Guardian reader, I thought the letter writing campaign was a rather dubious idea for precisely the reasons that have been given. How would I feel if I got a letter from (stereotype warning, OK?) some bible-bashing right-wing American, or indeed some earnest liberal American, telling me how I should vote in the general election next year? Still, I understand the impulse behind it; I share that frustration at not having any say in US elections that have so much impact beyond the US.

By: Andrew Boucher

Andrew Boucher — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 06:02:58 +0000

If foreigners are willing to pay American taxes, let them vote. No representation without taxation. Of course, they should first have to learn how to sing the Star-Spangled Banner.

By: reinstein

reinstein — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 02:46:34 +0000

perianwyr: that’s a very good change on the old saw “if you don’t like it here, leave,” viz., “if you don’t like it here, move here.” but if, as the pundits of globalization tell us, our ties across political borders will intensify, why should not governments to the point that the borders dissovle or change?

By: schwa

schwa — Wed, 20 Oct 2004 01:53:45 +0000

You’d think the Graun would’ve learned from Howard Dean’s experience of sending inundations of earnest, stupid letters written by earnest, stupid lefties to a conservative part of the country. Then again, with all the bloggers they could’ve chosen to write guest columns for them, they picked Instapundit and Kos, so maybe they’re just terminally thick. As for voting, in New Zealand, permanent residents have the full franchise, including Parliamentary elections. We’re stupidly generous like that. perianwyr – if you’d ever had any dealings with the INS, or whatever it’s called these days, you wouldn’t be so cavalier in throwing around “You may move here”, because the US immigration system is configured around the core assumption that unless you have superhuman tenacity and a great deal of luck, you mayn’t.