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	<title>Comments on: Nick Cohen, blogger</title>
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	<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/</link>
	<description>Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 13 Feb 2012 07:24:31 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Elmo</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63235</link>
		<dc:creator>Elmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63235</guid>
		<description>First visit, so forgive any misfires, wet powder, etc.

I was a lefty just a couple of short years ago. I still see the world mostly the same way (except of course militant radical Islam). I just am more willing to examine other&#039;s views, and not reject them automatically.

I rather enjoy no longer being so pompous, arrogant, and full of it and myself. Laughing at myself. While smiling at those still wearing lead boots. Who are unable to take a single step towards the center. If only to take a single stolen peek.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>First visit, so forgive any misfires, wet powder, etc.</p>

	<p>I was a lefty just a couple of short years ago. I still see the world mostly the same way (except of course militant radical Islam). I just am more willing to examine other&#8217;s views, and not reject them automatically.</p>

	<p>I rather enjoy no longer being so pompous, arrogant, and full of it and myself. Laughing at myself. While smiling at those still wearing lead boots. Who are unable to take a single step towards the center. If only to take a single stolen peek.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Briffa</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63236</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Briffa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63236</guid>
		<description>But don&#039;t you think Nick Cohen is gradually turning into Paul Johnson, Chris? It seems to happen to all Lefties eventually.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>But don&#8217;t you think Nick Cohen is gradually turning into Paul Johnson, Chris? It seems to happen to all Lefties eventually.</p>
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		<title>By: Russkle</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63237</link>
		<dc:creator>Russkle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63237</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m surprised that a CT post would take exception to a &quot;tone of outraged moral superiority&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I&#8217;m surprised that a CT post would take exception to a &#8220;tone of outraged moral superiority&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Jimmy Doyle</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63238</link>
		<dc:creator>Jimmy Doyle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63238</guid>
		<description>I think N Cohen&#039;s indignation has been directed more specifically at the majority of antiwar types, who think it perfectly obvious that nothing the US does could possibly have good consequences, or should be supported for any other reason; or soi-disants multiculturalists who believe a priori that any criticism of someone like al-Qaradawi is a manifestation of Islamophobia -- rather than merely &quot;those who take a different view to his own.&quot; There&#039;s a huge gap in this and kindred respects (I am glad to acknowledge) between CT and the ideological centre of gravity of the Guardian Comment section. From what I&#039;ve read of his recent output, I don&#039;t believe that he would regard CT (eg) as part of the &quot;pseudo-left,&quot; or be inclined to direct any more moral indignation towards it than you are here directing towards him, Chris.

He is also happy, if embarrassed, to acknowledge that what he said about Afghanistan was &quot;total bollocks,&quot;, resulting from an excess of credulity toward the predictions of international aid agencies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I think N Cohen&#8217;s indignation has been directed more specifically at the majority of antiwar types, who think it perfectly obvious that nothing the US does could possibly have good consequences, or should be supported for any other reason; or soi-disants multiculturalists who believe a priori that any criticism of someone like al-Qaradawi is a manifestation of Islamophobia&#8212;rather than merely &#8220;those who take a different view to his own.&#8221; There&#8217;s a huge gap in this and kindred respects (I am glad to acknowledge) between CT and the ideological centre of gravity of the Guardian Comment section. From what I&#8217;ve read of his recent output, I don&#8217;t believe that he would regard <span class="caps">CT </span>(eg) as part of the &#8220;pseudo-left,&#8221; or be inclined to direct any more moral indignation towards it than you are here directing towards him, Chris.</p>

	<p>He is also happy, if embarrassed, to acknowledge that what he said about Afghanistan was &#8220;total bollocks,&#8221;, resulting from an excess of credulity toward the predictions of international aid agencies.</p>
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		<title>By: dsquared</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63239</link>
		<dc:creator>dsquared</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63239</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;He is also happy, if embarrassed, to acknowledge that what he said about Afghanistan was “total bollocks,”, resulting from an excess of credulity toward the predictions of international aid agencies.&lt;/i&gt;

But very similar predictions appear to have been proved &lt;i&gt;right&lt;/i&gt; in the case of Iraq?  I must say I&#039;d really be interested in Cohen&#039;s views on the Lancet study.  Maybe I&#039;ll post something to that effect on his weblog.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>He is also happy, if embarrassed, to acknowledge that what he said about Afghanistan was &#8220;total bollocks,&#8221;, resulting from an excess of credulity toward the predictions of international aid agencies.</i></p>

	<p>But very similar predictions appear to have been proved <i>right</i> in the case of Iraq?  I must say I&#8217;d really be interested in Cohen&#8217;s views on the Lancet study.  Maybe I&#8217;ll post something to that effect on his weblog.</p>
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		<title>By: abb1</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63240</link>
		<dc:creator>abb1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63240</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;...the majority of antiwar types, who think it perfectly obvious that nothing the US does could possibly have good consequences...&lt;/i&gt;

Why, isn&#039;t it, indeed, perfectly obvious? Not &#039;nothing the US does&#039; necessarily, but the US starting a war, bombing and invading another third world country. What was the last time something like that had any good consequences for anyone outside the United Fruit, oil companies and arm dealers and manufacturers?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>&#8230;the majority of antiwar types, who think it perfectly obvious that nothing the US does could possibly have good consequences&#8230;</i></p>

	<p>Why, isn&#8217;t it, indeed, perfectly obvious? Not &#8216;nothing the US does&#8217; necessarily, but the US starting a war, bombing and invading another third world country. What was the last time something like that had any good consequences for anyone outside the United Fruit, oil companies and arm dealers and manufacturers?</p>
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		<title>By: Brendan</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63241</link>
		<dc:creator>Brendan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63241</guid>
		<description>Yeah but who are these people who proudly state that &#039;nothing the US does could ever have good consequences&#039;? Could you name them please? Where have they proclaimed this? 

The phrase &#039;pseudo left&#039; is highly dodgy btw: it was coined by the Maoist drones at LastSuperPower.net who are all, without exception, assholes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Yeah but who are these people who proudly state that &#8216;nothing the US does could ever have good consequences&#8217;? Could you name them please? Where have they proclaimed this?</p>

	<p>The phrase &#8216;pseudo left&#8217; is highly dodgy btw: it was coined by the Maoist drones at LastSuperPower.net who are all, without exception, assholes.</p>
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		<title>By: Adrian</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63242</link>
		<dc:creator>Adrian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63242</guid>
		<description>&quot;But very similar predictions appear to have been proved right in the case of Iraq?&quot;

Sorry, but where exactly are the predicted hordes of refugees desperately fleeing Iraq?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>&#8220;But very similar predictions appear to have been proved right in the case of Iraq?&#8221;</p>

	<p>Sorry, but where exactly are the predicted hordes of refugees desperately fleeing Iraq?</p>
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		<title>By: Conrad Barwa</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63243</link>
		<dc:creator>Conrad Barwa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63243</guid>
		<description>Personally, I have always had a bit of a soft for Cohen; despite the fact that he writes utter crap on Iraq and the so-called pro-war case. I think he does a good job at looking at the various unpopular causes of the day, most notably asylum-seekers and at exposing the cushiness of New Labour with various business interests. I get the sense that he is somehow conflicted about a lot of the arguments over the Iraq imbroglio and the chapter in his book Pretty Straight Guys that deals with it, seems almost to castigate the anti-war Left for the poor way it presented its case as opposed to the substance of it which he seemed by large to take seriously. Balanced against this has to be occasional diatribe he chucks out in the NS about ‘Islamo-fascism’ and how anybody opposed to the war and taking part in anti-war demos was somehow a supporter of totalitarianism, homophobic etc.etc.

&lt;i&gt;But don’t you think Nick Cohen is gradually turning into Paul Johnson, Chris? It seems to happen to all Lefties eventually.&lt;/i&gt;

Not really, in Cohen’s case he has too much dislike for a lot of Conservative bullshit for this to happen. His stance on issues such as immigration, race relations, influence of big business etc put him well on the left-liberal side of things.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Personally, I have always had a bit of a soft for Cohen; despite the fact that he writes utter crap on Iraq and the so-called pro-war case. I think he does a good job at looking at the various unpopular causes of the day, most notably asylum-seekers and at exposing the cushiness of New Labour with various business interests. I get the sense that he is somehow conflicted about a lot of the arguments over the Iraq imbroglio and the chapter in his book Pretty Straight Guys that deals with it, seems almost to castigate the anti-war Left for the poor way it presented its case as opposed to the substance of it which he seemed by large to take seriously. Balanced against this has to be occasional diatribe he chucks out in the NS about &#8216;Islamo-fascism&#8217; and how anybody opposed to the war and taking part in anti-war demos was somehow a supporter of totalitarianism, homophobic etc.etc.</p>

	<p><i>But don&#8217;t you think Nick Cohen is gradually turning into Paul Johnson, Chris? It seems to happen to all Lefties eventually.</i></p>

	<p>Not really, in Cohen&#8217;s case he has too much dislike for a lot of Conservative bullshit for this to happen. His stance on issues such as immigration, race relations, influence of big business etc put him well on the left-liberal side of things.</p>
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		<title>By: dsquared</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63244</link>
		<dc:creator>dsquared</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63244</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Sorry, but where exactly are the predicted hordes of refugees desperately fleeing Iraq?&lt;/i&gt;

Dead, mainly, according to the Lancet.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>Sorry, but where exactly are the predicted hordes of refugees desperately fleeing Iraq?</i></p>

	<p>Dead, mainly, according to the Lancet.</p>
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		<title>By: Adrian</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63245</link>
		<dc:creator>Adrian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63245</guid>
		<description>Stop ducking the question dsquared.  The aid agencies predicted a refugees crisis affecting millions, just as they had in Afghanistan.  It didn&#039;t happen.

The Lancet study, even if one is to accept its worst-case conclusions at face value, documents nothing of the sort.  In fact it&#039;s hard to say what that study documents apart from the prejudices of its authors, which clearly mesh comfortably with yours.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Stop ducking the question dsquared.  The aid agencies predicted a refugees crisis affecting millions, just as they had in Afghanistan.  It didn&#8217;t happen.</p>

	<p>The Lancet study, even if one is to accept its worst-case conclusions at face value, documents nothing of the sort.  In fact it&#8217;s hard to say what that study documents apart from the prejudices of its authors, which clearly mesh comfortably with yours.</p>
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		<title>By: abb1</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63246</link>
		<dc:creator>abb1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63246</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;The aid agencies predicted a refugees crisis&lt;/i&gt;

The distinction (without much difference) you&#039;re playing here is refugees vs. internally displaced persons. There are, obviously, hundreds of thousands, if not millions of IDs in Iraq; that they haven&#039;t left the country (for whatever reasons) is not necesarily something you should brag about.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>The aid agencies predicted a refugees crisis</i></p>

	<p>The distinction (without much difference) you&#8217;re playing here is refugees vs. internally displaced persons. There are, obviously, hundreds of thousands, if not millions of IDs in Iraq; that they haven&#8217;t left the country (for whatever reasons) is not necesarily something you should brag about.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin Donoghue</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63247</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Donoghue</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63247</guid>
		<description>&quot;In fact it’s hard to say what that study documents apart from the prejudices of its authors, which clearly mesh comfortably with yours.&quot;

Almost all doctors have a strong prejudice against premature mortality. Statisticians have a prejudice to the effect that if a parameter estimate is very much larger than zero, the true value of the parameter is very unlikely to be less than zero.

Those who do not share these prejudices would be well advised to stay away from medicine and statistics.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>&#8220;In fact it&#8217;s hard to say what that study documents apart from the prejudices of its authors, which clearly mesh comfortably with yours.&#8221;</p>

	<p>Almost all doctors have a strong prejudice against premature mortality. Statisticians have a prejudice to the effect that if a parameter estimate is very much larger than zero, the true value of the parameter is very unlikely to be less than zero.</p>

	<p>Those who do not share these prejudices would be well advised to stay away from medicine and statistics.</p>
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		<title>By: Brendan</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63248</link>
		<dc:creator>Brendan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63248</guid>
		<description>What is one to make of a man who seems literally unable to tell the difference between the past and the future? Obviously everything he has to say about everything can and must be ignored (and ridiculed) but still, let&#039;s waste some time and point out the most blatant error I have seen even by the low standards of pro-war rhetoric. 

There is all the difference in the world between a prediction of the future and a statement that something has happened in the past (and is still happening). Predictions are (and please stop me if i&#039;m boring everyone who can read without moving their lips) by definition, uncertain. They might be right, they might be wrong. That&#039;s the way it is. 

Statements about the past, on the other hand, are either true or false. There is no ambiguity. 

Now: either the amount of people (within confidence intervals) stated in the Lancet study died: or they didn&#039;t. To the best of my knowledge not one coherent counter-argument to the Lancet&#039;s study has been produced. I.e. some people have made obvious and facile criticisms (most of which were acknowledge by the authors themselves), or else they have pointed out that more research is needed (true, but also true of all scientific studies). 

But to the best of my knowledge not one serious critique of the study has been published BY A SERIOUS EPIDEMIOLOGIST OR STATISTICIAN. 
Certainly lots of illiterate arts graduates have gotten pretty excited by phrases like &#039;confidence intervals&#039; (which they have obviously never encountered before) but their opinions are worthless. 

Given that their opinions are worthless, one can go onto looking at motives. Here&#039;s a clue as to what their motives might be. What are the motives of those who attempt to minimise casualties inflicted by the Khmer Rouge? What are the motives of those who downplay the numbers of Jews exterminated by the Nazis? What are the motives of those who downplay the numbers of Stalin&#039;s victims?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>What is one to make of a man who seems literally unable to tell the difference between the past and the future? Obviously everything he has to say about everything can and must be ignored (and ridiculed) but still, let&#8217;s waste some time and point out the most blatant error I have seen even by the low standards of pro-war rhetoric.</p>

	<p>There is all the difference in the world between a prediction of the future and a statement that something has happened in the past (and is still happening). Predictions are (and please stop me if i&#8217;m boring everyone who can read without moving their lips) by definition, uncertain. They might be right, they might be wrong. That&#8217;s the way it is.</p>

	<p>Statements about the past, on the other hand, are either true or false. There is no ambiguity.</p>

	<p>Now: either the amount of people (within confidence intervals) stated in the Lancet study died: or they didn&#8217;t. To the best of my knowledge not one coherent counter-argument to the Lancet&#8217;s study has been produced. I.e. some people have made obvious and facile criticisms (most of which were acknowledge by the authors themselves), or else they have pointed out that more research is needed (true, but also true of all scientific studies).</p>

	<p>But to the best of my knowledge not one serious critique of the study has been published <span class="caps">BY A SERIOUS EPIDEMIOLOGIST OR STATISTICIAN</span>.<br />
Certainly lots of illiterate arts graduates have gotten pretty excited by phrases like &#8216;confidence intervals&#8217; (which they have obviously never encountered before) but their opinions are worthless.</p>

	<p>Given that their opinions are worthless, one can go onto looking at motives. Here&#8217;s a clue as to what their motives might be. What are the motives of those who attempt to minimise casualties inflicted by the Khmer Rouge? What are the motives of those who downplay the numbers of Jews exterminated by the Nazis? What are the motives of those who downplay the numbers of Stalin&#8217;s victims?</p>
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		<title>By: Brendan</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/comment-page-1/#comment-63249</link>
		<dc:creator>Brendan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/wp/2005/02/28/nick-cohen-blogger/#comment-63249</guid>
		<description>Students of the rhetoric of abuse will of course have noticed that reference to &#039;illiterate&#039; arts graduates should of course read &#039;innumerate&#039; arts graduates, although of course most of them are also illiterate, as their sleazy little blogs amply demonstrate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Students of the rhetoric of abuse will of course have noticed that reference to &#8216;illiterate&#8217; arts graduates should of course read &#8216;innumerate&#8217; arts graduates, although of course most of them are also illiterate, as their sleazy little blogs amply demonstrate.</p>
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