Comments on: Drezner Denied

By: Boîte noire » Archive du blog » Garfielddgate, anonymisation des données et utopie

Sat, 21 Jan 2006 12:09:12 +0000

[...] Cette affaire en rappelle d’autres. Elle fait écho au sort de plusieurs bloggueurs en entreprise ayant perdu leur emploi suite à la découverte de leur blog par leurs collègues et/ou leur direction. À plusieurs égards, elle rappelle aussi l’universitaire et bloggueur américain Daniel Drezner, qui contre toute attente n’avait pas obtenu sa tenure à l’université de Chicago [cf. sa note et celle de Crooked Timber]. À l’époque, la blogosphère académique anglo-américaine a été très prolixe sur le sujet, tout comme la blogosphère française actuellement. [...]

By: Kieran Healy

Kieran Healy — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 19:13:29 +0000

On reflection, having read Ben Alper’s comment, I’ve decided to close this thread. You can discuss it further on Dan’s blog if you like.

By: RedWolf

RedWolf — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 18:26:04 +0000

Blogging and fame are not basis for tenure and shouldn’t be. Too few researchers pay attention to real contribution. Most academics are flailing through a long and meaningless publication list. As an academic and a parent to somebody on the UC faculty, it seems that UC tends to look for “beef.”

Whether Dan Drezner delivered the beef, I simply don’t know.

As for tenure: it’s like democracy, both are bad systems but every other system is much worse.

By: save_the_rustbelt

save_the_rustbelt — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 17:51:51 +0000

I’ve been a college lecturer most of my adult life, without having to worry about tenure (I make plenty of money in a specialty consulting practice).

Tenure is one of the most bizarre and corrupt processes I have ever seen.

Corrupt in the sense that the process is clearly spelled out in writing, but most of that is ignored in the politics of the department, college and university.

Teaching has almost nothing to do with tenure, despite what is written in the governance documents.

Dan will do fine, U.of C. and the students have lost.

By: Dan Drezner

Dan Drezner — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 17:41:00 +0000

I hereby endorse… er… hashing

By: otto

otto — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 17:17:38 +0000

Maybe ben a. is right..

By: Ben Alpers

Ben Alpers — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 14:08:34 +0000

Am I the only one who feels vaguely uncomfortable about a public discussion of a tenure case the relevant details of which most (perhaps all) of us do not know?

It would be one thing if Dan Drezner initiated this conversation (as he did on his own site). But absent his endorsement of a public hashing out of his case at CrookedTimber, might the polite course of action be to express sympathy for him and then to give him a little space?

By: gzombie

gzombie — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 13:57:39 +0000

So, Sean Carrol and Dan Drezner both denied tenure. It seems blogging is bad for you, at least in tenure cases.

You can’t be serious. What percentage of total recent tenure decisions in all of academia do you think these two represent?

By: otto

otto — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 13:57:00 +0000

I like bloggers, and DD’s blog, and wish DD the best of luck – but can someone point me to the research that DD’s claim to tenure at Chicago based on? Not the number of articles per se, but say one article (or better, more) which is now an absolute must-read article for a graduate course in IR or IPE? That’s the sort of standard for tenure at a top US research university and one that other young IPErs like Hiscox at Harvard or Vreeland at Yale would, in my view, be able to satisfy.

By: Matt

Matt — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 13:15:42 +0000

As for whether blogging is bad for getting tenure I suspect that it will vary from dept. to dept. (perhaps even field to field) too much to make general statements. It’s worth noting, though, that Brian Weatherson got tenure while blogging, and Chris Bertram was promoted. I’m sure there are others. Just by looking at his CV Drezner’s case does seem to be a surprising one. In philosophy, though, you could probably make a top-five department just out of people who were denied tenure on their first time around.

By: DavidH

DavidH — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 12:07:38 +0000

Would it be naive to ask whether tenure is likely to actually mean life tenure in ten or twenty years time?

From the outside looking in, the structure of academia seems to be under assault at the moment and I wonder if the generalised tendency to invoke change for the sake of change will eventually bring down the tenure system. I have no particular views on the matter, but aren’t there people who believe tenure is an undeserved privilege? Somehow “undemocratic”?

Not that I’m suggesting Daniel Drezner should be happy about the decision.

DVH

By: John Quiggin

John Quiggin — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 09:03:46 +0000

I notice that Dan mentions the possibility that he has published too much, something Harry discussed a little while ago.

Similarly, I’ve been told that, if I wanted to get a job in a top US econ department, I’d be well advised to delete most of my output from my resumé before I sent it in.

Out here on the far side of the world, the attitude is very different, thankfully, though I don’t know that either blogging or appearing in the mainstream media is an unqualified asset.

By: Seth Finkelstein

Seth Finkelstein — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 06:08:14 +0000

I’m vaguely reminded of George Carlin’s “Jesus made me fumble” joke. As he [Drezner] says, “who the hell knows?”.

By: Hektor Bim

Hektor Bim — Sun, 09 Oct 2005 03:59:22 +0000

So, Sean Carrol and Dan Drezner both denied tenure. It seems blogging is bad for you, at least in tenure cases.