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	<title>Comments on: Open Holland v Portugal Thread</title>
	<atom:link href="http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/</link>
	<description>Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made</description>
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		<title>By: Asad</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-4/#comment-162330</link>
		<dc:creator>Asad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jun 2006 21:24:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-162330</guid>
		<description>Hey does anyone have a picture of deco, van bronckhorst, and whoever the third guy was sitting on the stairs. Thanks</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Hey does anyone have a picture of deco, van bronckhorst, and whoever the third guy was sitting on the stairs. Thanks</p>
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		<title>By: stostosto</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-4/#comment-161884</link>
		<dc:creator>stostosto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jun 2006 10:24:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161884</guid>
		<description>&quot;I think all available soccer contempt should be focussed in a laser-like beam at the near-crippler of Cristiano Ronaldo &quot;

Henry is worthy of contempt. Boulahrouz is worthy of a criminal court trial.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>&#8220;I think all available soccer contempt should be focussed in a laser-like beam at the near-crippler of Cristiano Ronaldo &#8221;</p>

	<p>Henry is worthy of contempt. Boulahrouz is worthy of a criminal court trial.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob G</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-4/#comment-161767</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob G</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 20:06:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161767</guid>
		<description>&quot;He is worthy of all musterable contempt.&quot; OK, I&#039;ll try and shift over a bit from Bush to Henry then.

But seriously, I think all available soccer contempt should be focussed in a laser-like beam at the near-crippler of Cristiano Ronaldo (Dutch guy - Boula-something-or-other). And I say that as an England fan who would welcome CR&#039;s absence.

Jake, definitely less, if you mean other-outcome perverted. My guess, maybe 2, which is par for the (perverted) course.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>&#8220;He is worthy of all musterable contempt.&#8221; OK, I&#8217;ll try and shift over a bit from Bush to Henry then.</p>

	<p>But seriously, I think all available soccer contempt should be focussed in a laser-like beam at the near-crippler of Cristiano Ronaldo (Dutch guy &#8211; Boula-something-or-other). And I say that as an England fan who would welcome CR&#8217;s absence.</p>

	<p>Jake, definitely less, if you mean other-outcome perverted. My guess, maybe 2, which is par for the (perverted) course.</p>
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		<title>By: JakeBCool</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-4/#comment-161732</link>
		<dc:creator>JakeBCool</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 18:24:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161732</guid>
		<description>So I have the impression that the course of about 5 of the 8 second-round games were perverted by bad calls or tolerance of bad behavior.  More? less?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>So I have the impression that the course of about 5 of the 8 second-round games were perverted by bad calls or tolerance of bad behavior.  More? less?</p>
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		<title>By: stostosto</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-161696</link>
		<dc:creator>stostosto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 15:33:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161696</guid>
		<description>&quot;#145, Henry’s usually fairly sporting. Save your contempt for more worthy recipients.&quot;

I wasn&#039;t talking about how Henry &lt;i&gt;usually&lt;/i&gt; conducts himself. I was talking about this particular, contemptible, incident. What he &quot;usually&quot; does has little bearing on that. In fact, you might say he took advantage of whatever sporting reputation he might have in order to cheat and deceive so much the more effective. He is worthy of all musterable contempt.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>&#8220;#145, Henry&#8217;s usually fairly sporting. Save your contempt for more worthy recipients.&#8221;</p>

	<p>I wasn&#8217;t talking about how Henry <i>usually</i> conducts himself. I was talking about this particular, contemptible, incident. What he &#8220;usually&#8221; does has little bearing on that. In fact, you might say he took advantage of whatever sporting reputation he might have in order to cheat and deceive so much the more effective. He is worthy of all musterable contempt.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob G</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-161690</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob G</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 13:57:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161690</guid>
		<description>I think Belle&#039;s writing about the Portugal-Holland game. It was rather operatic, but the mikes didn&#039;t pick up the arias very well, and I&#039;m not sure who the &quot;champions of idealistic virtue&quot; were.

#145, Henry&#039;s usually fairly sporting. Save your contempt for more worthy recipients.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I think Belle&#8217;s writing about the Portugal-Holland game. It was rather operatic, but the mikes didn&#8217;t pick up the arias very well, and I&#8217;m not sure who the &#8220;champions of idealistic virtue&#8221; were.</p>

	<p>#145, Henry&#8217;s usually fairly sporting. Save your contempt for more worthy recipients.</p>
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		<title>By: dale</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-161687</link>
		<dc:creator>dale</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 13:27:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161687</guid>
		<description>it is a pretty bizarre paragraph...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>it is a pretty bizarre paragraph&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: a</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-161679</link>
		<dc:creator>a</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 11:52:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161679</guid>
		<description>belle:  no problem belle, I have a thin skin! Mind you, I didn&#039;t under your last paragraph at all...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>belle:  no problem belle, I have a thin skin! Mind you, I didn&#8217;t under your last paragraph at all&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: belle le triste</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-161673</link>
		<dc:creator>belle le triste</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 10:53:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161673</guid>
		<description>a i was only teasing you a little: i think your proof of american moral superiority is funny, especially when i&#039;m watching US wrestling

one of the things i like about football is that it allows for the possibility that OVERT AND CYNICAL VILLAINY -- such as is being denounced all up and down this thread -- gets its righteous defeat on the pitch (rather than warded off in advance by more rigorously robotic reffing); but for this to be reach operatic scale, it has to advance through a sequence of arguably disgraceful minor results, featuring the sacrifice of well-meaning but not up-to-it unlikely rough-diamond champions of idealistic virtue</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>a i was only teasing you a little: i think your proof of american moral superiority is funny, especially when i&#8217;m watching US wrestling</p>

	<p>one of the things i like about football is that it allows for the possibility that <span class="caps">OVERT AND CYNICAL VILLAINY </span>&#8212;such as is being denounced all up and down this thread&#8212;gets its righteous defeat on the pitch (rather than warded off in advance by more rigorously robotic reffing); but for this to be reach operatic scale, it has to advance through a sequence of arguably disgraceful minor results, featuring the sacrifice of well-meaning but not up-to-it unlikely rough-diamond champions of idealistic virtue</p>
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		<title>By: stostosto</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-161667</link>
		<dc:creator>stostosto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 09:23:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161667</guid>
		<description>&quot;how much of henry’s free kick was play-acting&quot;

I thought the free-kick was legit, but Henry then childishly, disgracefully, feigned having been hit in the face. He deserved a booking for that performance, at least. And he deserves the general contempt of the footballing world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>&#8220;how much of henry&#8217;s free kick was play-acting&#8221;</p>

	<p>I thought the free-kick was legit, but Henry then childishly, disgracefully, feigned having been hit in the face. He deserved a booking for that performance, at least. And he deserves the general contempt of the footballing world.</p>
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		<title>By: yabonn</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-161665</link>
		<dc:creator>yabonn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 09:03:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161665</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;France got through because one of its players cheated.&lt;/i&gt;

At that point i was about to say it&#039;s a rather silly thing to say, but then you made clear where you come from :

&lt;i&gt;that’s life as it’s taught in France&lt;/i&gt;

Whatever, expert.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>France got through because one of its players cheated.</i></p>

	<p>At that point i was about to say it&#8217;s a rather silly thing to say, but then you made clear where you come from :</p>

	<p><i>that&#8217;s life as it&#8217;s taught in France</i></p>

	<p>Whatever, expert.</p>
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		<title>By: dale</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-161664</link>
		<dc:creator>dale</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 09:00:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161664</guid>
		<description>&quot;spain were a disappointment&quot; 


thought so too - i rooted for spain, as so many times before, and they really ought to go through, one fine day, but they choked again and failed to score goals. zidane and ribery were both magic. henry...well. he cheats. and especialy when things don&#039;t work for him or his timing goes off - first he start bitching at other players and then the professional misdemeanours begin. 

so the consensus was that puyol was innocent? pity then. 

even so, spain lacked finishing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>&#8220;spain were a disappointment&#8221;</p>


	<p>thought so too &#8211; i rooted for spain, as so many times before, and they really ought to go through, one fine day, but they choked again and failed to score goals. zidane and ribery were both magic. henry&#8230;well. he cheats. and especialy when things don&#8217;t work for him or his timing goes off &#8211; first he start bitching at other players and then the professional misdemeanours begin.</p>

	<p>so the consensus was that puyol was innocent? pity then.</p>

	<p>even so, spain lacked finishing.</p>
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		<title>By: stostosto</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-161659</link>
		<dc:creator>stostosto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 08:27:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161659</guid>
		<description>Henry&#039;s play acting was disgraceful. Reminiscent of Rivaldo&#039;s against Turkey in 2002. 

Henry played an awful match through and through. About 15 times off-side and nothing to show for it. I don&#039;t know why the French have him playing forward instead of letting him play holding like he does in Arsenal.

Zidane, by contrast, did brilliantly. And Ribery, who outshone them all.

Spain were a disappointment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Henry&#8217;s play acting was disgraceful. Reminiscent of Rivaldo&#8217;s against Turkey in 2002.</p>

	<p>Henry played an awful match through and through. About 15 times off-side and nothing to show for it. I don&#8217;t know why the French have him playing forward instead of letting him play holding like he does in Arsenal.</p>

	<p>Zidane, by contrast, did brilliantly. And Ribery, who outshone them all.</p>

	<p>Spain were a disappointment.</p>
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		<title>By: a</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-161658</link>
		<dc:creator>a</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 08:21:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161658</guid>
		<description>I saw it just one in replay.  What I saw was  *henry* grabbing puyol and then falling down.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I saw it just one in replay.  What I saw was  <strong>henry</strong> grabbing puyol and then falling down.</p>
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		<title>By: stostosto</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-161657</link>
		<dc:creator>stostosto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 08:20:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/25/open-holland-v-portugal-thread/#comment-161657</guid>
		<description>#127:

&lt;i&gt;Indeed, and it is called diving. If the player has the option to continue the play or to fall to the ground, no penalty should be given if he opts for the latter.&lt;/i&gt;

There is a difference between diving when there is nothing to dive about and diving when your opponent is late with his tackle. Often the attacker will have the option of continue the play in the latter case, but often he will also have been slowed down and/or lost balance. Hence it&#039;s a foul. In that situation the diving, as I said, goes to demonstrate the foul. True diving is when no foul is committed in the first place.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>#127:</p>

	<p><i>Indeed, and it is called diving. If the player has the option to continue the play or to fall to the ground, no penalty should be given if he opts for the latter.</i></p>

	<p>There is a difference between diving when there is nothing to dive about and diving when your opponent is late with his tackle. Often the attacker will have the option of continue the play in the latter case, but often he will also have been slowed down and/or lost balance. Hence it&#8217;s a foul. In that situation the diving, as I said, goes to demonstrate the foul. True diving is when no foul is committed in the first place.</p>
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