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	<title>Comments on: SWIFT and Europe</title>
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	<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/</link>
	<description>Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made</description>
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		<title>By: Michael Kenny</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-162589</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Kenny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jul 2006 09:27:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-162589</guid>
		<description>A banker friend here in Luxembourg said to me that what the banking industry objects to is the far too broad sweep of the information SWIFT supplied. They see it as going far beyond the legitimate requirements of law enforcement and being little more than a pretext for economic espionage. As he put it: &quot;Bush has scored another own goal!&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>A banker friend here in Luxembourg said to me that what the banking industry objects to is the far too broad sweep of the information <span class="caps">SWIFT</span> supplied. They see it as going far beyond the legitimate requirements of law enforcement and being little more than a pretext for economic espionage. As he put it: &#8220;Bush has scored another own goal!&#8221; </p>
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		<title>By: Michael B</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-162102</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jun 2006 04:16:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-162102</guid>
		<description>Unquestionably, monocular vision is better than no vision at all, but binocular vision lends perspective and balance; privacy is a perfectly valid concern, &lt;a href=&quot;http://americanfuture.net/?p=1852&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;not the only concern&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Unquestionably, monocular vision is better than no vision at all, but binocular vision lends perspective and balance; privacy is a perfectly valid concern, <a href="http://americanfuture.net/?p=1852" rel="nofollow">not the only concern</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: trotsky</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-162018</link>
		<dc:creator>trotsky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jun 2006 22:15:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-162018</guid>
		<description>Man, this international finance stuff is complicated, but comment 14 is all Greek to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Man, this international finance stuff is complicated, but comment 14 is all Greek to me.</p>
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		<title>By: Σπιτάκι &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Big Brother SWIFT</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161997</link>
		<dc:creator>Σπιτάκι &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Big Brother SWIFT</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jun 2006 21:08:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161997</guid>
		<description>[...] Μετά το wiretapping της NSA, πρόσφατα έχει διαρεύσει πως οι Αμερικάνοι συνεργάζονται και με τη SWIFT, μια παγκόσμια βάση financial δεδομένων. Μπορεί αυτό το πρόγραμμα να είναι καλό, όπως προτείνει ο Hannibal; Δεν ξέρω, μα δεν το νομίζω. Το βασικό κριτήριο του για να πει πως είναι καλό, είναι πως θα υπάρχει πραγματικό oversight. Μα απ&#8217; ό,τι φαίνεται μέχρι στιγμής, τα πράγματα δε δουλεύαν ακριβώς έτσι &#8212; τώρα που οι Ευρωπαϊκές κυβερνήσεις ξέρουν τι συμβαίνει (δημοσίως, γιατί προφανώς κάποιοι μπορεί να ξέρανε νωρίτερα), θα δούμε τι θα γίνει. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>[...] &#924;&#949;&#964;ά &#964;&#959; wiretapping &#964;&#951;&#962; <span class="caps">NSA</span>, &#960;&#961;ό&#963;&#966;&#945;&#964;&#945; έ&#967;&#949;&#953; &#948;&#953;&#945;&#961;&#949;ύ&#963;&#949;&#953; &#960;&#969;&#962; &#959;&#953; &#913;&#956;&#949;&#961;&#953;&#954;ά&#957;&#959;&#953; &#963;&#965;&#957;&#949;&#961;&#947;ά&#950;&#959;&#957;&#964;&#945;&#953; &#954;&#945;&#953; &#956;&#949; &#964;&#951; <span class="caps">SWIFT</span>, &#956;&#953;&#945; &#960;&#945;&#947;&#954;ό&#963;&#956;&#953;&#945; &#946;ά&#963;&#951; financial &#948;&#949;&#948;&#959;&#956;έ&#957;&#969;&#957;. &#924;&#960;&#959;&#961;&#949;ί &#945;&#965;&#964;ό &#964;&#959; &#960;&#961;ό&#947;&#961;&#945;&#956;&#956;&#945; &#957;&#945; &#949;ί&#957;&#945;&#953; &#954;&#945;&#955;ό, ό&#960;&#969;&#962; &#960;&#961;&#959;&#964;&#949;ί&#957;&#949;&#953; &#959; Hannibal; &#916;&#949;&#957; &#958;έ&#961;&#969;, &#956;&#945; &#948;&#949;&#957; &#964;&#959; &#957;&#959;&#956;ί&#950;&#969;. &#932;&#959; &#946;&#945;&#963;&#953;&#954;ό &#954;&#961;&#953;&#964;ή&#961;&#953;&#959; &#964;&#959;&#965; &#947;&#953;&#945; &#957;&#945; &#960;&#949;&#953; &#960;&#969;&#962; &#949;ί&#957;&#945;&#953; &#954;&#945;&#955;ό, &#949;ί&#957;&#945;&#953; &#960;&#969;&#962; &#952;&#945; &#965;&#960;ά&#961;&#967;&#949;&#953; &#960;&#961;&#945;&#947;&#956;&#945;&#964;&#953;&#954;ό oversight. &#924;&#945; &#945;&#960;&#8217; ό,&#964;&#953; &#966;&#945;ί&#957;&#949;&#964;&#945;&#953; &#956;έ&#967;&#961;&#953; &#963;&#964;&#953;&#947;&#956;ή&#962;, &#964;&#945; &#960;&#961;ά&#947;&#956;&#945;&#964;&#945; &#948;&#949; &#948;&#959;&#965;&#955;&#949;ύ&#945;&#957; &#945;&#954;&#961;&#953;&#946;ώ&#962; έ&#964;&#963;&#953; &#8212; &#964;ώ&#961;&#945; &#960;&#959;&#965; &#959;&#953; &#917;&#965;&#961;&#969;&#960;&#945;ϊ&#954;έ&#962; &#954;&#965;&#946;&#949;&#961;&#957;ή&#963;&#949;&#953;&#962; &#958;έ&#961;&#959;&#965;&#957; &#964;&#953; &#963;&#965;&#956;&#946;&#945;ί&#957;&#949;&#953; (&#948;&#951;&#956;&#959;&#963;ί&#969;&#962;, &#947;&#953;&#945;&#964;ί &#960;&#961;&#959;&#966;&#945;&#957;ώ&#962; &#954;ά&#960;&#959;&#953;&#959;&#953; &#956;&#960;&#959;&#961;&#949;ί &#957;&#945; &#958;έ&#961;&#945;&#957;&#949; &#957;&#969;&#961;ί&#964;&#949;&#961;&#945;), &#952;&#945; &#948;&#959;ύ&#956;&#949; &#964;&#953; &#952;&#945; &#947;ί&#957;&#949;&#953;. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Maria</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161880</link>
		<dc:creator>Maria</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jun 2006 09:59:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161880</guid>
		<description>What&#039;s not clear to me from the reports I&#039;ve read is what - if any - legal instrument was used for the transfers. Data sharing with third (i.e. non-EU)  countries can be lawful if a mutual assistance agreement is invoked. If, as it seems, no particular instrument was used, then SWIFT may well be liable to enforcement actions. 

As to the creation of instruments for data-sharing; this is moving quite quickly within the EU, but I&#039;m less knowledgeable on the generally bi-lateral agreemetns with third countries. But I do know that a data protection directive on the specific applications within justice and home affairs has been in draft form for at least a year, but hasn&#039;t yet see the light of day.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>What&#8217;s not clear to me from the reports I&#8217;ve read is what &#8211; if any &#8211; legal instrument was used for the transfers. Data sharing with third (i.e. non-EU)  countries can be lawful if a mutual assistance agreement is invoked. If, as it seems, no particular instrument was used, then <span class="caps">SWIFT</span> may well be liable to enforcement actions.</p>

	<p>As to the creation of instruments for data-sharing; this is moving quite quickly within the EU, but I&#8217;m less knowledgeable on the generally bi-lateral agreemetns with third countries. But I do know that a data protection directive on the specific applications within justice and home affairs has been in draft form for at least a year, but hasn&#8217;t yet see the light of day.</p>
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		<title>By: P O'Neill</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161845</link>
		<dc:creator>P O'Neill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jun 2006 04:01:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161845</guid>
		<description>From Thursday&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/ireland/2006/0629/1203278408HM10CIAFOLLOWUP.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Irish Times&lt;/a&gt;, reaction to the Privacy International complaint:

&lt;em&gt;Seán Sweeney, compliance officer at the Irish data protection commissioner&#039;s office, said he could not comment on whether an investigation was ongoing in the Swift case.

But he said in such a case the commissioner would have to establish a few key pieces of information early on. &quot;Has the personal data of people resident in Ireland been accessed? If so, by whom, how and from where? The access point will be very important in determining jurisdiction. If Irish data are accessed in Belgium, it will be necessary to establish the conditions under which the data were supplied to Swift, in order to determine what power the commissioner may have to investigate.&quot;

Labour MEP Proinsias De Rossa said the Swift case was yet another example of the erosion of EU citizens&#039; civil rights in the name of the US &quot;war on terror&quot;.

&quot;It is not acceptable that the CIA or FBI can access records like this,&quot; said Mr De Rossa, who urged the Government to hold an inquiry into the monitoring of banking records and called on the Irish Central Bank to explain what it knew about the CIA programme.

Several central banks in Europe knew that Swift was passing on details to the CIA from its US offices, but it is understood that many did not tell their governments.

The Irish Central Bank refuses to confirm or deny whether it knew.&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>From Thursday&#8217;s <a href="http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/ireland/2006/0629/1203278408HM10CIAFOLLOWUP.html" rel="nofollow">Irish Times</a>, reaction to the Privacy International complaint:</p>

	<p><em>Se&#225;n Sweeney, compliance officer at the Irish data protection commissioner&#8217;s office, said he could not comment on whether an investigation was ongoing in the Swift case.</em></p>

	<p>But he said in such a case the commissioner would have to establish a few key pieces of information early on. &#8220;Has the personal data of people resident in Ireland been accessed? If so, by whom, how and from where? The access point will be very important in determining jurisdiction. If Irish data are accessed in Belgium, it will be necessary to establish the conditions under which the data were supplied to Swift, in order to determine what power the commissioner may have to investigate.&#8221;</p>

	<p>Labour <span class="caps">MEP </span>Proinsias De Rossa said the Swift case was yet another example of the erosion of EU citizens&#8217; civil rights in the name of the <span class="caps">US </span>&#8220;war on terror&#8221;.</p>

	<p>&#8220;It is not acceptable that the <span class="caps">CIA</span> or <span class="caps">FBI</span> can access records like this,&#8221; said Mr De Rossa, who urged the Government to hold an inquiry into the monitoring of banking records and called on the Irish Central Bank to explain what it knew about the <span class="caps">CIA</span> programme.</p>

	<p>Several central banks in Europe knew that Swift was passing on details to the <span class="caps">CIA</span> from its US offices, but it is understood that many did not tell their governments.</p>

	<p>The Irish Central Bank refuses to confirm or deny whether it knew.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Maguire</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161835</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Maguire</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jun 2006 02:17:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161835</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;As I said in the post, I wouldn’t be surprised if some people in the govts in question did know what was happening, and tacitly went along with it. I haven’t seen any evidence of this, but I wouldn’t be surprised.&lt;/i&gt;

Allow me to non-surprise you: the Belgian National Bank admits it was in the know, but sort of didn&#039;t pass the news along; now the &lt;a href=&quot;http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory?id=2118625&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Belgian DoJ&lt;/a&gt;, alerted by media reports, is investigating the SWIFT program.

Some excerpts in anticipation of link-rot:

&lt;i&gt;Belgium’s national bank (BNB) admitted yesterday that it knew that the US was monitoring financial transactions via the Swift system, which is based in Belgium, as part of its “war on terror”.

Earlier the country’s justice ministry said it had launched an inquiry into the covert US spy programme.

Spokeswoman Anaik De Voghel said Justice Minister Laurette Onkelinx had ordered the Belgian intelligence services to investigate the programme, confirmed by senior US officials Friday after it was leaked to US media.

“We had the information in the context of our monitoring activities” of Swift (Society for Worldwide Interbank Financial Transactions), a BNB spokesman said, refusing to say when it had that information.

“We were alerted informally in the framework of our contacts with this enterprise,” he said.&lt;/i&gt;

http://www.gulf-times.com/site/topics/article.asp?cu_no=2&amp;item_no=93906&amp;version=1&amp;template_id=39&amp;parent_id=21

And:

&lt;i&gt;Belgium&#039;s government is investigating the legality of counter-terrorism searches by U.S. officials of thousands of private records held by Brussels-based international bank cooperative SWIFT, a spokeswoman said.

... Belgian Justice Minister Laurette Onkelinx learned of the searches from the media and asked Belgium&#039;s national security services and counter-fraud office to produce reports into the matter before the end of the week, a ministry spokeswoman said.

&quot;She wants to know if these actions taken by the U.S. and SWIFT are okay under Belgian law,&quot; Annaik De Voghel told Reuters on Monday. Security officials will discuss the issue later this week, she added.

A spokesman for European Commissioner for Justice and Home Affairs Franco Frattini said it did not appear that the European Union&#039;s executive body had any competence in the matter.

&quot;At first sight there is no European legislation covering this type of transfer and (it is) therefore a matter of national law,&quot; he said.

Belgium&#039;s central bank sought to distance itself from the affair, saying in a statement on Sunday that its role as head of the oversight body for SWIFT was limited.

&quot;The monitoring of SWIFT&#039;s activities that do not affect financial stability is not a matter for the oversight group and therefore the U.S. Treasury subpoenas of SWIFT were outside the purview of central bank oversight,&quot; the statement said. &lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>As I said in the post, I wouldn&#8217;t be surprised if some people in the govts in question did know what was happening, and tacitly went along with it. I haven&#8217;t seen any evidence of this, but I wouldn&#8217;t be surprised.</i></p>

	<p>Allow me to non-surprise you: the Belgian National Bank admits it was in the know, but sort of didn&#8217;t pass the news along; now the <a href="http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory?id=2118625" rel="nofollow">Belgian DoJ</a>, alerted by media reports, is investigating the <span class="caps">SWIFT</span> program.</p>

	<p>Some excerpts in anticipation of link-rot:</p>

	<p><i>Belgium&#8217;s national bank (BNB) admitted yesterday that it knew that the US was monitoring financial transactions via the Swift system, which is based in Belgium, as part of its &#8220;war on terror&#8221;.</i></p>

	<p>Earlier the country&#8217;s justice ministry said it had launched an inquiry into the covert US spy programme.</p>

	<p>Spokeswoman Anaik De Voghel said Justice Minister Laurette Onkelinx had ordered the Belgian intelligence services to investigate the programme, confirmed by senior US officials Friday after it was leaked to US media.</p>

	<p>&#8220;We had the information in the context of our monitoring activities&#8221; of Swift (Society for Worldwide Interbank Financial Transactions), a <span class="caps">BNB</span> spokesman said, refusing to say when it had that information.</p>

	<p>&#8220;We were alerted informally in the framework of our contacts with this enterprise,&#8221; he said.</p>

	<p><a href="http://www.gulf-times.com/site/topics/article.asp?cu_no=2&#038;item_no=93906&#038;version=1&#038;template_id=39&#038;parent_id=21" rel="nofollow">http://www.gulf-times.com/site/topics/article.asp?cu_no=2&#038;item_no=93906&#038;version=1&#038;template_id=39&#038;parent_id=21</a></p>

	<p>And:</p>

	<p><i>Belgium&#8217;s government is investigating the legality of counter-terrorism searches by U.S. officials of thousands of private records held by Brussels-based international bank cooperative <span class="caps">SWIFT</span>, a spokeswoman said.</i></p>

	<p>&#8230; Belgian Justice Minister Laurette Onkelinx learned of the searches from the media and asked Belgium&#8217;s national security services and counter-fraud office to produce reports into the matter before the end of the week, a ministry spokeswoman said.</p>

	<p>&#8220;She wants to know if these actions taken by the U.S. and <span class="caps">SWIFT</span> are okay under Belgian law,&#8221; Annaik De Voghel told Reuters on Monday. Security officials will discuss the issue later this week, she added.</p>

	<p>A spokesman for European Commissioner for Justice and Home Affairs Franco Frattini said it did not appear that the European Union&#8217;s executive body had any competence in the matter.</p>

	<p>&#8220;At first sight there is no European legislation covering this type of transfer and (it is) therefore a matter of national law,&#8221; he said.</p>

	<p>Belgium&#8217;s central bank sought to distance itself from the affair, saying in a statement on Sunday that its role as head of the oversight body for <span class="caps">SWIFT</span> was limited.</p>

	<p>&#8220;The monitoring of <span class="caps">SWIFT</span>&#8217;s activities that do not affect financial stability is not a matter for the oversight group and therefore the U.S. Treasury subpoenas of <span class="caps">SWIFT</span> were outside the purview of central bank oversight,&#8221; the statement said. </p>
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		<title>By: nik</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161802</link>
		<dc:creator>nik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 23:02:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161802</guid>
		<description>I think Sebastian makes a really good point.

Henry&#039;s correct that as far as the law is concerned everyone has an obligation not to do things which are illegal. If central banks don&#039;t have the authority to clear them the fact that SWIFT told member central banks what was going on doesn&#039;t excuse them.

But as public authorities responsible for monitoring the banking sector don&#039;t central banks actively have positive obligations? If they knew someone was doing something illegal then why didn&#039;t they act to uphold the law? If they didn&#039;t know then can&#039;t we question their competence?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I think Sebastian makes a really good point.</p>

	<p>Henry&#8217;s correct that as far as the law is concerned everyone has an obligation not to do things which are illegal. If central banks don&#8217;t have the authority to clear them the fact that <span class="caps">SWIFT</span> told member central banks what was going on doesn&#8217;t excuse them.</p>

	<p>But as public authorities responsible for monitoring the banking sector don&#8217;t central banks actively have positive obligations? If they knew someone was doing something illegal then why didn&#8217;t they act to uphold the law? If they didn&#8217;t know then can&#8217;t we question their competence?</p>
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		<title>By: Steve LaBonne</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161799</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve LaBonne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 22:25:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161799</guid>
		<description>I also don&#039;t think it&#039;s necessarily completely out of bounds &lt;i&gt;provided&lt;/i&gt; all the necessary legal and diplomatic niceties are attended to first, so that one doesn&#039;t end up poisoning the well as seems likely to happen here. Of course, that&#039;s not the Bush way...

But I&#039;m getting sick of these idiots, and their sycophants, braying about how they&#039;re making us safer when so many of their actions have exactly the contrary effect.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I also don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s necessarily completely out of bounds <i>provided</i> all the necessary legal and diplomatic niceties are attended to first, so that one doesn&#8217;t end up poisoning the well as seems likely to happen here. Of course, that&#8217;s not the Bush way&#8230;</p>

	<p>But I&#8217;m getting sick of these idiots, and their sycophants, braying about how they&#8217;re making us safer when so many of their actions have exactly the contrary effect.</p>
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		<title>By: Henry</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161769</link>
		<dc:creator>Henry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 20:11:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161769</guid>
		<description>bq. Presuming that the central banks did not have the authority necessary, isn’t it the responsibility of those people to either pass the information along to the right people and/or fail to authorize the program? Are you arguing that the various government did not in fact know about the program? It seems to me a much more classic case of maintaining theoretical deniability than lack of knowledge.

As I said in the post, I wouldn&#039;t be surprised if some people in the govts in question did know what was happening, and tacitly went along with it. I haven&#039;t seen any evidence of this, but I wouldn&#039;t be surprised. But the point is, that unless I&#039;m wrong (and I could be - not a lawyer as stated - although I have been following legal developments in this area as a political scientist), SWIFT&#039;s cooperation was illegal. Government knowledge or lack of knowledge makes no odds here as far as I can tell. If the member states of the EU had entered into some sort of protocol with the US regarding this information, or even if individual member states had done this, it would be a different kettle of fish altogether. And as best as I can tell, SWIFT seem to share this analysis - they were clearly highly uncomfortable about the situation they were in, and to the extent that they have articulated a public defence, it&#039;s been a conflict of laws defence (which is unlikely to cut much ice afik).

Steve Labonne - I didn&#039;t pronounce on the rights or wrongs of this too heavily, but I&#039;m actually considerably less perturbed about this than about various other forms of information gathering that we&#039;ve been finding out about. As best as I can tell from publicly available information there were some checks and balances here, and the information has been used for the relatively narrow purpose of fighting terrorism. That said, I think this will be a highly emotive issue for Europeans - as stated, I think that they&#039;ll feel as strongly about this as Americans would under similar circumstances.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<blockquote>Presuming that the central banks did not have the authority necessary, isn&#8217;t it the responsibility of those people to either pass the information along to the right people and/or fail to authorize the program? Are you arguing that the various government did not in fact know about the program? It seems to me a much more classic case of maintaining theoretical deniability than lack of knowledge.</blockquote>

	<p>As I said in the post, I wouldn&#8217;t be surprised if some people in the govts in question did know what was happening, and tacitly went along with it. I haven&#8217;t seen any evidence of this, but I wouldn&#8217;t be surprised. But the point is, that unless I&#8217;m wrong (and I could be &#8211; not a lawyer as stated &#8211; although I have been following legal developments in this area as a political scientist), <span class="caps">SWIFT</span>&#8217;s cooperation was illegal. Government knowledge or lack of knowledge makes no odds here as far as I can tell. If the member states of the EU had entered into some sort of protocol with the US regarding this information, or even if individual member states had done this, it would be a different kettle of fish altogether. And as best as I can tell, <span class="caps">SWIFT</span> seem to share this analysis &#8211; they were clearly highly uncomfortable about the situation they were in, and to the extent that they have articulated a public defence, it&#8217;s been a conflict of laws defence (which is unlikely to cut much ice afik).</p>

	<p>Steve Labonne &#8211; I didn&#8217;t pronounce on the rights or wrongs of this too heavily, but I&#8217;m actually considerably less perturbed about this than about various other forms of information gathering that we&#8217;ve been finding out about. As best as I can tell from publicly available information there were some checks and balances here, and the information has been used for the relatively narrow purpose of fighting terrorism. That said, I think this will be a highly emotive issue for Europeans &#8211; as stated, I think that they&#8217;ll feel as strongly about this as Americans would under similar circumstances.</p>
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		<title>By: AMERICAN FUTURE - Trying to make sense of a world in turmoil &#187; First the Belgians, Now the Irish</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161758</link>
		<dc:creator>AMERICAN FUTURE - Trying to make sense of a world in turmoil &#187; First the Belgians, Now the Irish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 19:53:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161758</guid>
		<description>[...] From the Irish Times (headlined &quot;CIA monitors personal bank data of Irish citizens&quot;) with thanks to Crooked Timber: [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>[...] From the Irish Times (headlined &#8220;CIA monitors personal bank data of Irish citizens&#8221;) with thanks to Crooked Timber: [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Isabel</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161744</link>
		<dc:creator>Isabel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 19:09:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161744</guid>
		<description>(Of course the wingnuts will never notice nor understand the irony of this sort of thing…)

No, they won&#039;t. American nonwingnuts won&#039;t notice either: I don&#039;t think that there was one single article that mentioned anything else than &quot;American citizens&quot; in the receveing end of all that spying. A navel the size of a continent.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>(Of course the wingnuts will never notice nor understand the irony of this sort of thing&#8230;)</p>

	<p>No, they won&#8217;t. American nonwingnuts won&#8217;t notice either: I don&#8217;t think that there was one single article that mentioned anything else than &#8220;American citizens&#8221; in the receveing end of all that spying. A navel the size of a continent.</p>
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		<title>By: Sebastian Holsclaw</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161739</link>
		<dc:creator>Sebastian Holsclaw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 18:54:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161739</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t understand what you are saying about the US notifying the wrong people in the respective governments.  Presuming that the central banks did not have the authority necessary, isn&#039;t it the responsibility of those people to either pass the information along to the right people and/or fail to authorize the program?  Are you arguing that the various government did not in fact know about the program?  It seems to me a much more classic case of maintaining theoretical deniability than lack of knowledge.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I don&#8217;t understand what you are saying about the US notifying the wrong people in the respective governments.  Presuming that the central banks did not have the authority necessary, isn&#8217;t it the responsibility of those people to either pass the information along to the right people and/or fail to authorize the program?  Are you arguing that the various government did not in fact know about the program?  It seems to me a much more classic case of maintaining theoretical deniability than lack of knowledge.</p>
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		<title>By: P O'Neill</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161701</link>
		<dc:creator>P O'Neill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 16:07:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161701</guid>
		<description>Sorry Henry.  In the excitement of them having a finance article linkable, I missed it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Sorry Henry.  In the excitement of them having a finance article linkable, I missed it.</p>
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		<title>By: Henry</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2006/06/28/swift-and-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-161699</link>
		<dc:creator>Henry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 15:55:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=4841#comment-161699</guid>
		<description>I link to the _Irish Times_ story in there (in fairness it&#039;s buried amid the rest of the verbiage).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I link to the <em>Irish Times</em> story in there (in fairness it&#8217;s buried amid the rest of the verbiage).</p>
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