Comments on: The dismal science of freedom http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/ Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made Mon, 13 Feb 2012 09:29:41 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Zeph http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-166920 Zeph Tue, 01 Aug 2006 12:39:54 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/#comment-166920 Add Charles Dickens to the ranks of the would-be racists. (He was in the Carlyle camp). Add Charles Dickens to the ranks of the would-be racists. (He was in the Carlyle camp).

]]> By: Harald Korneliussen http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-166743 Harald Korneliussen Mon, 31 Jul 2006 06:33:30 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/#comment-166743 There is an essay on this exact topic at econlog. I got the link from Marginal Revolution. (This may be the text you wanted to link to, neel, but I couldn't get yours to work) http://www.econlib.org/LIBRARY/Columns/LevyPeartdismal.html There is an essay on this exact topic at econlog. I got the link from Marginal Revolution. (This may be the text you wanted to link to, neel, but I couldn’t get yours to work)

http://www.econlib.org/LIBRARY/Columns/LevyPeartdismal.html

]]> By: Dabodius http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-166737 Dabodius Mon, 31 Jul 2006 04:03:25 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/#comment-166737 IIRC, Carlyle originally entitled his <i>Discourse</i> as we have it now; somebody edited it to "Negro," and Carlyle changed it back. It should be read, not as a treatment of economics, but a touchstone of political ressentiment. When slavery was abolished in Jamaica, the free blacks discovered that they didn't need to work the plantations for wages, but could subsist as small freeholders on their own crops, mainly pumpkin, which could be grown with little labor. Carlyle was outraged that "Quashee" had leisure, to loaf and fornicate or (one thinks) smoke ganja and invent ska; he should have been miserable and kept working the plantations, whose production had fallen off. For the sake of "Quashee's" morals and the Empire's agricultural needs, then, Carlyle proposed that the black Jamaicans be re-enslaved. If utilitarianism is a flawed moral philosophy, disutilitarianism must be worse, and Carlyle's example of it or of an unhappy aretaicism has its counterparts today in e.g. the RW folk who don't want their daughters vaccinated against HPV. IIRC, Carlyle originally entitled his Discourse as we have it now; somebody edited it to “Negro,” and Carlyle changed it back. It should be read, not as a treatment of economics, but a touchstone of political ressentiment.

When slavery was abolished in Jamaica, the free blacks discovered that they didn’t need to work the plantations for wages, but could subsist as small freeholders on their own crops, mainly pumpkin, which could be grown with little labor. Carlyle was outraged that “Quashee” had leisure, to loaf and fornicate or (one thinks) smoke ganja and invent ska; he should have been miserable and kept working the plantations, whose production had fallen off. For the sake of “Quashee’s” morals and the Empire’s agricultural needs, then, Carlyle proposed that the black Jamaicans be re-enslaved.

If utilitarianism is a flawed moral philosophy, disutilitarianism must be worse, and Carlyle’s example of it or of an unhappy aretaicism has its counterparts today in e.g. the RW folk who don’t want their daughters vaccinated against HPV.

]]> By: vivian http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-166733 vivian Mon, 31 Jul 2006 00:31:25 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/#comment-166733 p o'neill, that would be dismal indeed... p o’neill, that would be dismal indeed…

]]> By: marcel http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-166732 marcel Mon, 31 Jul 2006 00:30:55 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/#comment-166732 P O'Neill (5 above): No, much like Friedman's positive economics, you will see grown men responding to an economics talk <i>as if</i> it were a circumcision. P O’Neill (5 above): No, much like Friedman’s positive economics, you will see grown men responding to an economics talk as if it were a circumcision.

]]> By: P O'Neill http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-166711 P O'Neill Sun, 30 Jul 2006 19:14:34 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/#comment-166711 I read your 1st sentence too quickly and thought for one brief moment that there was going to be an economics talk at a circumcision. I read your 1st sentence too quickly and thought for one brief moment that there was going to be an economics talk at a circumcision.

]]> By: Jim Harrison http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-166696 Jim Harrison Sun, 30 Jul 2006 16:33:22 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/#comment-166696 I don't know if Carlyle intended the same reference, but Nietzsche's Gay Science was partly an allusion to the Gai Saber, the Troubadour art of love poetry. I don’t know if Carlyle intended the same reference, but Nietzsche’s Gay Science was partly an allusion to the Gai Saber, the Troubadour art of love poetry.

]]> By: Neel Krishnaswami http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-166694 Neel Krishnaswami Sun, 30 Jul 2006 15:53:12 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/#comment-166694 David Levy wrote a book,<a> <em>How the Dismal Science Got its Name</em></a>, which goes into great detail about this. (I think I got the ref from dsquared.) David Levy wrote a book, How the Dismal Science Got its Name, which goes into great detail about this. (I think I got the ref from dsquared.)

]]> By: post pc http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-166678 post pc Sun, 30 Jul 2006 13:01:11 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/#comment-166678 in other words, as a qucik followup, we have a collective institutional memory, rich with experience even and an extended literture, of prior periods of monetary instability and failure. we have nothing similar with regard to climate change, except thru paleo/geologic abstracts... to end it dismally :D cheers! in other words, as a qucik followup, we have a collective institutional memory, rich with experience even and an extended literture, of prior periods of monetary instability and failure. we have nothing similar with regard to climate change, except thru paleo/geologic abstracts… to end it dismally :D

cheers!

]]> By: post pc http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-166677 post pc Sun, 30 Jul 2006 12:48:52 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2006/07/30/the-dismal-science-of-freedom/#comment-166677 wasn't it also that malthus didn't treat the environment as an infinite sink? at some point there are measureable (negative) externalities, that if not incorporated into economic stewardship, tips the ecosystem into a new partial- 'equilibrium' state, which lowers public utility/general welfare in the process. like the case could be made that global warming is like inflation - an unwelcome result of running the economy 'too hot, for too long' - and that a 'central bank' is needed to regulate economic activity 'within bounds' so as not to upset the balance - to maintain price/temperature at acceptable levels in order to maximize "economic progress with environmental sustainability." at <i>what</i> levels and <i>thru which</i> levers of thermostatic control i cannot say (carbon credits?), but comparing the institutional resources at the disposal of monetary policy around the world and that of environmental policy, provides a glimpse at the enormity of the challenge for creating a body/mechanism/framework to address global warming. and while the consequences of failure for monetary policy implies a return to the gold standard or a barter economy, what analogous fallback is there to a failure of environmental policy? the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eocene" rel="nofollow">eocene</a>?<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geologic_timescale" rel="nofollow">*</a> wasn’t it also that malthus didn’t treat the environment as an infinite sink? at some point there are measureable (negative) externalities, that if not incorporated into economic stewardship, tips the ecosystem into a new partial- ‘equilibrium’ state, which lowers public utility/general welfare in the process.

like the case could be made that global warming is like inflation – an unwelcome result of running the economy ‘too hot, for too long’ – and that a ‘central bank’ is needed to regulate economic activity ‘within bounds’ so as not to upset the balance – to maintain price/temperature at acceptable levels in order to maximize “economic progress with environmental sustainability.”

at what levels and thru which levers of thermostatic control i cannot say (carbon credits?), but comparing the institutional resources at the disposal of monetary policy around the world and that of environmental policy, provides a glimpse at the enormity of the challenge for creating a body/mechanism/framework to address global warming.

and while the consequences of failure for monetary policy implies a return to the gold standard or a barter economy, what analogous fallback is there to a failure of environmental policy? the eocene?*

]]>