Comments on: Welcome … to Fantasy Ireland

By: huxley

huxley — Fri, 27 Apr 2007 15:26:27 +0000

Why are there no welsh-themed pubs

Hey honey, how about we go to that Welsh pub? What was it’s name again … uhmmm … oh yeah, the Llanfairpwllgwyngyll-gogerychwyrndrobwll-llantysilio-gogogoch Pub! No, the one on Lower Water Street. You’re thinking of the Gorsafawddacha’idraigodanheddogleddollôn penrhynareurdraethceredigion Tavern. Okay, meet you there …

By: rea

rea — Wed, 25 Apr 2007 13:53:02 +0000

Why are there no welsh-themed pubs

We had a Welsh-themed establishment here in my home town, but the Health Department closed it down—too many people were taking leeks in the barroom . . .

By: Colleen

Colleen — Tue, 24 Apr 2007 18:43:15 +0000

Post #8 stated “…In Northern Ireland attacks executed with the purpose of maximizing civilian casualties were the exceptions, rather than the rule as seems to be the case in Iraq. The same can be said for the odd spillover attack in the Republic, and the frequent spillover attacks in England.”
I have to disagree. The attacks in Northern Ireland were definitely intended to have civilian casualties. That is why the IRA bombed stores and hotels. Yes, they did bomb hotels. I was in Lurgan in about 1977 and visited The Orchard – a very nice hotel. When I went back in about 1979 or 1980 it had been bombed TWICE by the IRA. Civilian targets were absolutely the weapon of choice for the IRA in Northern Ireland – I’d venture to say probably in England, too, with the exception of attacks on the royal family. And, yes, I do have relatives in Northern Ireland. My mom was born there.

By: Andrew Taggart

Andrew Taggart — Tue, 24 Apr 2007 02:05:03 +0000

To Otto/#17: Well, except for the fact that General Dyer personally ordered troops to open fire on a non-violent civilian demonstration in Armistsar and stated in a inquiry (apologies if this is Attenbourogh taking historical licenses) that he would have used machineguns if he could have brought them to bear. Whereas Sharon…err…didn’t do anything like that. Until you have evidence of Sharon telling the Maronites to go in and do their worst and he’ll look the other way or ORDERING them to kill men, women and children, Sabra and Shatilla, as horrible as they were, are simply not morally the same thing. This is NOT an excuse for Sharon. I am just sick of seeing this type of cheap ahistorical analogy seep in every time Israel/Palestine comes up. Attack Sharon on his own terms and for what he did, there is quite enough there without chucking in strained historical analogies.

As for internment and the six counties/northern ireland vs. Iraq, the level of violence, the nature of the insurgency and the alignment of forces is so radically different that lessons one way or the other cannot usefully be drawn. To take a perhaps obvious example, the UK could rely on the RUC and the UDR from day one (and one of the things they had to do early on is remove the thuggish but enthusiastic B Specials). Whereas outside of the Peshmerga the story of Iraq is the absence of forces of order and the inability of the coalition to call them into being. Perhaps Ireland 1798?

By: dsquared

dsquared — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 22:24:04 +0000

The ‘plastic paddy’ phenomenon baffles me. Why are there no welsh-themed pubs, or international st patrick’s day celebrations? It can’t all be down to Guinness, surely.

no, yes it can. The modern St Patrick’s Day experience/craze has a hell of a lot to do with the marketing department of Diageo, for the very good reason that they have as near as dammit a monopoly on worldwide stout, so they know that they can promote the festival without pouring marketing dollars in someone else’s tank. If the Andorrans had a cultural tradition of drinking Miller Lite and only Miller Lite then you bet your bippy that St Merixtell’s Day would be a bigger event than it is.

By: harry b

harry b — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 20:56:13 +0000

#25—but Thatcher had nothing to do with internment, and while she was hard line during the hunger strike, her government post the hunger strike began the softening of policy (despite maintaining a hard line in public, and this started before and continued despite the Grand bombing). I think that British officials understood that internment was a disaster never to be repeated—i’ve even spoken to a couple of Tory MPs who admitted that the PTA was also a disaster, but one that could not be revoked for political reasons.

By: Jon H

Jon H — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 18:27:08 +0000

“It’s because Irish-Americans became prominent regional politicians in the early and middle 20th Century, and reminding everyone of their Irishness was a good way to get their Irish-American constituents to vote for them. Similarly, Columbus Day is a national holiday in the US because of Italian-Americans.”

That doesn’t begin to explain it. There’s no Italian equivalent of people (Irish or not) wearing green on St. Patrick’s day. Nor are there zillions of Italian bars around, the way Irish pubs are omnipresent and frequently not even owned or operated by Irish people.

I think the main thing in the US is the strong association of “Irish” with social drinking, ie, fun times. “Italian” is associated with food and (like it or not) the mob, thus there are no Columbus Day pub crawls, but there are plenty of Italian restaurants and pizza joints.

By: otto

otto — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 16:23:42 +0000

Just to say that I like CT’s Hibernoblogging. Let’s have more of it.

By: Doug

Doug — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 15:34:45 +0000

18: Mr. O’Roarke, obvsly.

By: P O'Neill

P O'Neill — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 15:07:21 +0000

Airey Neave was an INLA job. But in Maggie’s mind, same difference.

By: Dale Sunning and Anne F.O'Blacht

Dale Sunning and Anne F.O'Blacht — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 14:33:45 +0000

“Back to topic, can internment ever be successful in winning hearts and minds? In Ireland, heavy handed policing was more successful in creating Bobby Sands style martyrs than in putting down opposition”

Gotta say, Thatcher’s policies re. the Maze and the Hunger Strikers, in retrospect made No Sense At All to me (essentially her hard line attitude set the Shinners up on their upward path to supplant the SDLP).

Then I remembered that her close personal friend, Airey Neave (who was also first British officer to escape from Colditz) was assassinated by a carbomb by the IRA in 1979. Hence Thatcher’s huge miscalculation.

By: Jim E-H

Jim E-H — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 14:04:10 +0000

The ‘plastic paddy’ phenomenon baffles me. Why are there no welsh-themed pubs, or international st patrick’s day celebrations? It can’t all be down to Guinness, surely.

It’s because Irish-Americans became prominent regional politicians in the early and middle 20th Century, and reminding everyone of their Irishness was a good way to get their Irish-American constituents to vote for them. Similarly, Columbus Day is a national holiday in the US because of Italian-Americans.

By: otto

otto — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 13:47:13 +0000

Thank you Karl

By: Barry

Barry — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 13:10:48 +0000

“In fairness to Petraeus, it seems like he is at least trying to introduce a measure of reality into assessments of the situation in Baghdad. ”

Once Petraeus starts spouting absolute 100% like that, fairness demands that he be classified with the other Bush appointees – dishonest wh*resons (and -daughters).

Which really stinks, because the other hallmark of Bush appointees is absolute incompetancy at everything except domestic USA politics.

By: Karl Steel

Karl Steel — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 13:06:41 +0000

Otto, for context see here.