<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Things I Don&#8217;t Understand</title>
	<atom:link href="http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/</link>
	<description>Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 27 May 2012 04:59:01 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: roger</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-215078</link>
		<dc:creator>roger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2007 18:50:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-215078</guid>
		<description>Slocum is right about the vileness of al qaeda. They even spread a rumor that American security companies are allowed to murder Iraqis with impunity, not excluding the guards of the Iraqi president. Imagine! The rumor they started, so vile, from start to finish, is that the State department itself would go so far as to cover up the murder of Iraqis by drunk American mercs by getting them out of Iraq, then covering up their records so they could be rehired to go back to the Middle East.

This is obviously preposterous. No democratic country, especially the U.S., which just idealistically wants to spread democracy around the globe,  would countenance repeated acts of pure and simple murder.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Slocum is right about the vileness of al qaeda. They even spread a rumor that American security companies are allowed to murder Iraqis with impunity, not excluding the guards of the Iraqi president. Imagine! The rumor they started, so vile, from start to finish, is that the State department itself would go so far as to cover up the murder of Iraqis by drunk American mercs by getting them out of Iraq, then covering up their records so they could be rehired to go back to the Middle East.</p>

	<p>This is obviously preposterous. No democratic country, especially the U.S., which just idealistically wants to spread democracy around the globe,  would countenance repeated acts of pure and simple murder.</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andrew R.</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214995</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew R.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2007 12:01:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214995</guid>
		<description>Merk,

Bear in mind, though, that he&#039;s also criticizing the U.S. government&#039;s &lt;i&gt;current&lt;/i&gt; policies in Afghanistan.  And for most of 2005, at the time when the administration was screaming that the Iranians were arming the insurgency, he was, at that time, saying that there was very little evidence of Iranian involvement.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Merk,</p>

	<p>Bear in mind, though, that he&#8217;s also criticizing the U.S. government&#8217;s <i>current</i> policies in Afghanistan.  And for most of 2005, at the time when the administration was screaming that the Iranians were arming the insurgency, he was, at that time, saying that there was very little evidence of Iranian involvement.</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: merkur</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214930</link>
		<dc:creator>merkur</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 17:45:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214930</guid>
		<description>&quot;After all, a lot of his recent reporting in Al Anbar takes pains to point out how counter-productive a lot of the Marine Corps’s earlier, more forceful actions were in alienating civilians who might not otherwise be inclined to sympathize with the various insurgencies.&quot;

While I actually think Yon&#039;s reporting is quite good, and I do respect him for putting himself out there, the key point in your point above is that he is pointing out how much earlier actions were counter-productive - compared, of course, to the surge.  If the surge passes and a more &quot;forceful&quot; effort appears, I have no doubt that he would also report how counter-productive the current efforts were.  The point is that he is reporting the narrative that the establishment wants people to hear - yes, we screwed things up a bit in the past, but our current approach is guaranteed to work.  Yon fits right into this narrative, and always has done.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>&#8220;After all, a lot of his recent reporting in Al Anbar takes pains to point out how counter-productive a lot of the Marine Corps&#8217;s earlier, more forceful actions were in alienating civilians who might not otherwise be inclined to sympathize with the various insurgencies.&#8221;</p>

	<p>While I actually think Yon&#8217;s reporting is quite good, and I do respect him for putting himself out there, the key point in your point above is that he is pointing out how much earlier actions were counter-productive &#8211; compared, of course, to the surge.  If the surge passes and a more &#8220;forceful&#8221; effort appears, I have no doubt that he would also report how counter-productive the current efforts were.  The point is that he is reporting the narrative that the establishment wants people to hear &#8211; yes, we screwed things up a bit in the past, but our current approach is guaranteed to work.  Yon fits right into this narrative, and always has done.</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Slocum</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214928</link>
		<dc:creator>Slocum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 17:30:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214928</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;...he was the uncritical peddler of the tale that had al-qaeda in iraq feeding people their own children, and there’s nothing like some anti-arab blood libel to get the conservative blogosphere buzzing!&lt;/i&gt;

Hmmm -- now I don&#039;t understand.  Having dug up the report (which I&#039;d not seen) it seems grossly inaccurate to suggest Yon was an &#039;uncritical peddler&#039; of the story.  He reports than an Iraqi official made that claim -- that&#039;s all.  And, in fact, just before that account, he explicitly says that it&#039;s difficult to know for certain whether or not Al Queda was responsible for a particular massacre:

Since my reporting of the massacre at the al Hamari village, many readers at home have asked how anyone can know that al Qaeda actually performed the massacre. The question is a very good one, and one that I posed from the first hour to Iraqis and Americans while trying to ascertain facts about the killings.

No one can claim with certainty that it was al Qaeda, but the Iraqis here seem convinced of it. 
http://www.michaelyon-online.com/wp/baqubah-update-05-july-2007.htm

Not exactly the words of an uncritical peddler of Al Queda horror stories.

Yes, the &#039;baking their sons&#039; story does seem preposterous and Iraqis do seem somewhat prone to propagate wild stories and conspiracy theories.  But on the other hand, before the war, I would have thought many of the indisputable horrors of Al Queda in Iraq to be preposterous.  

So is it your position that Al Queda in Iraq really isn&#039;t as bad as advertised?  Or that the widely known atrocities of Al Queda are not already sufficient to &#039;get the conservative blogosphere buzzing&#039;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>&#8230;he was the uncritical peddler of the tale that had al-qaeda in iraq feeding people their own children, and there&#8217;s nothing like some anti-arab blood libel to get the conservative blogosphere buzzing!</i></p>

	<p>Hmmm&#8212;now I don&#8217;t understand.  Having dug up the report (which I&#8217;d not seen) it seems grossly inaccurate to suggest Yon was an &#8216;uncritical peddler&#8217; of the story.  He reports than an Iraqi official made that claim&#8212;that&#8217;s all.  And, in fact, just before that account, he explicitly says that it&#8217;s difficult to know for certain whether or not Al Queda was responsible for a particular massacre:</p>

	<p>Since my reporting of the massacre at the al Hamari village, many readers at home have asked how anyone can know that al Qaeda actually performed the massacre. The question is a very good one, and one that I posed from the first hour to Iraqis and Americans while trying to ascertain facts about the killings.</p>

	<p>No one can claim with certainty that it was al Qaeda, but the Iraqis here seem convinced of it.<br />
<a href="http://www.michaelyon-online.com/wp/baqubah-update-05-july-2007.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.michaelyon-online.com/wp/baqubah-update-05-july-2007.htm</a></p>

	<p>Not exactly the words of an uncritical peddler of Al Queda horror stories.</p>

	<p>Yes, the &#8216;baking their sons&#8217; story does seem preposterous and Iraqis do seem somewhat prone to propagate wild stories and conspiracy theories.  But on the other hand, before the war, I would have thought many of the indisputable horrors of Al Queda in Iraq to be preposterous.</p>

	<p>So is it your position that Al Queda in Iraq really isn&#8217;t as bad as advertised?  Or that the widely known atrocities of Al Queda are not already sufficient to &#8216;get the conservative blogosphere buzzing&#8217;?</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: abb1</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214921</link>
		<dc:creator>abb1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 13:49:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214921</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Gah, that last post ate the remainder of my comment.&lt;/i&gt;

Ah, such is the irredeemable vileness of WordPress. 

But why should he be trying to show something - anything - by this sort of rumor-mongering, if he is supposed to be an even-handed truth-telling reporter? Would he report a rumor about US marines baking a child and feeding him to his parents?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>Gah, that last post ate the remainder of my comment.</i></p>

	<p>Ah, such is the irredeemable vileness of WordPress.</p>

	<p>But why should he be trying to show something &#8211; anything &#8211; by this sort of rumor-mongering, if he is supposed to be an even-handed truth-telling reporter? Would he report a rumor about US marines baking a child and feeding him to his parents?</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andrew R.</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214919</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew R.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 13:05:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214919</guid>
		<description>Gah, that last post ate the remainder of my comment.  My conclusion was that, yeah, it could definitely be used for anti-Arab racism, but I think that he was trying to show the irredeemable vileness of AQ rather than the irredeemable vileness of Arabs/Muslims.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Gah, that last post ate the remainder of my comment.  My conclusion was that, yeah, it could definitely be used for anti-Arab racism, but I think that he was trying to show the irredeemable vileness of AQ rather than the irredeemable vileness of Arabs/Muslims.</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andrew R.</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214918</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew R.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 13:03:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214918</guid>
		<description>Belle,

Fair point.  But I still think that you simplify his take a bit.  After all, a lot of his recent reporting in Al Anbar takes pains to point out how counter-productive a lot of the Marine Corps&#039;s earlier, more forceful actions were in alienating civilians who might not otherwise be inclined to sympathize with the various insurgencies.  

As for the whole cannibal business, is it anti-Arab racism if you&#039;re writing about something that was done *to* Arabs?  &gt;Thinks a bit</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Belle,</p>

	<p>Fair point.  But I still think that you simplify his take a bit.  After all, a lot of his recent reporting in Al Anbar takes pains to point out how counter-productive a lot of the Marine Corps&#8217;s earlier, more forceful actions were in alienating civilians who might not otherwise be inclined to sympathize with the various insurgencies.</p>

	<p>As for the whole cannibal business, is it anti-Arab racism if you&#8217;re writing about something that was done <strong>to</strong> Arabs?  >Thinks a bit</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Alex</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214911</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 10:07:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214911</guid>
		<description>37: &quot;If one harbours anywhere in his mind a nationalist prejudice, certain facts though known in a sense to be true are inadmissible..&quot;

Has he ever asked himself why he&#039;s still there getting shot at when the politicians he idolises promised the mission was accomplished back in May &#039;03? Compare his writing from Diyala with, say, Phil Carter&#039;s, who was there as an actual soldier.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>37: &#8220;If one harbours anywhere in his mind a nationalist prejudice, certain facts though known in a sense to be true are inadmissible..&#8221;</p>

	<p>Has he ever asked himself why he&#8217;s still there getting shot at when the politicians he idolises promised the mission was accomplished back in May &#8216;03? Compare his writing from Diyala with, say, Phil Carter&#8217;s, who was there as an actual soldier.</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: novakant</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214902</link>
		<dc:creator>novakant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 07:27:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214902</guid>
		<description>Worst of all, Yon and Totten are both capitalizing on the immensely popular idea that there is some sort of all-encompassing liberal media conspiracy designed to paint an inaccurately bleak picture of the situation in Iraq and to malign the actions of US soldiers, while conversely they are almost alone in reporting the true facts on the ground. This idea has been introduced by Rumsfeld and the neocons almost from day one and has been one of the most counterproductive features of the whole US effort in Iraq. Even if Yon and Totten throw in the odd morsel of critical reporting, a look at the comments section shows that this is what their readers want to hear, this is what they believe and this is why these blogs are so successful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Worst of all, Yon and Totten are both capitalizing on the immensely popular idea that there is some sort of all-encompassing liberal media conspiracy designed to paint an inaccurately bleak picture of the situation in Iraq and to malign the actions of US soldiers, while conversely they are almost alone in reporting the true facts on the ground. This idea has been introduced by Rumsfeld and the neocons almost from day one and has been one of the most counterproductive features of the whole US effort in Iraq. Even if Yon and Totten throw in the odd morsel of critical reporting, a look at the comments section shows that this is what their readers want to hear, this is what they believe and this is why these blogs are so successful.</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Belle Waring</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214894</link>
		<dc:creator>Belle Waring</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 03:53:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214894</guid>
		<description>frizzled: it&#039;s absolutely &lt;em&gt;not&lt;/em&gt; a joke, as you can see from reading Carol&#039;s other comments. I don&#039;t know what black cabs are because I haven&#039;t been to the UK in many, many years, not since I was a teenager.

andrew r.: Yon unquestionably has the courage of his convictions, and deserves a lot of credit for repeatedly putting his money where his warblogging mouth is. he has been willing to report some bad news from Iraq in the past. however, he was the uncritical peddler of the tale that had al-qaeda in iraq feeding people their own children, and there&#039;s nothing like some anti-arab blood libel to get the conservative blogosphere buzzing! further, he seems to have the view that if people around the world could just understand how personally heroic and well-intentioned individual US soldiers are, they&#039;d stop thinking the US is a blundering bully fucking up people&#039;s shit around the world. this is...fundamentally misguided. I also never see him address the fact that he &lt;em&gt;must&lt;/em&gt; embed with US forces and can&#039;t possibly just go walking around in iraq reporting on ordinary life. why not? because he&#039;d get killed, and wit a quickness. this should be a more salient point in his reporting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>frizzled: it&#8217;s absolutely <em>not</em> a joke, as you can see from reading Carol&#8217;s other comments. I don&#8217;t know what black cabs are because I haven&#8217;t been to the UK in many, many years, not since I was a teenager.</p>

	<p>andrew r.: Yon unquestionably has the courage of his convictions, and deserves a lot of credit for repeatedly putting his money where his warblogging mouth is. he has been willing to report some bad news from Iraq in the past. however, he was the uncritical peddler of the tale that had al-qaeda in iraq feeding people their own children, and there&#8217;s nothing like some anti-arab blood libel to get the conservative blogosphere buzzing! further, he seems to have the view that if people around the world could just understand how personally heroic and well-intentioned individual US soldiers are, they&#8217;d stop thinking the US is a blundering bully fucking up people&#8217;s shit around the world. this is&#8230;fundamentally misguided. I also never see him address the fact that he <em>must</em> embed with US forces and can&#8217;t possibly just go walking around in iraq reporting on ordinary life. why not? because he&#8217;d get killed, and wit a quickness. this should be a more salient point in his reporting.</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: P O'Neill</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214883</link>
		<dc:creator>P O'Neill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 01:39:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214883</guid>
		<description>In a later link to Yon, Glenn reveals a dream

&lt;em&gt;And maybe by next year he&#039;ll be reporting from Iran.&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>In a later link to Yon, Glenn reveals a dream</p>

	<p><em>And maybe by next year he&#8217;ll be reporting from Iran.</em></p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andrew R.</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214877</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew R.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 00:34:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214877</guid>
		<description>Alex and Roger,

Just out of curiosity, have you actually, you know, read Michael Yon?  He&#039;s about as far as you can get from an uncritical war booster.  For example, in 2005 when Diyala was going to s**t, he was one of the few people outside of some Knight-Ridder reporters to chronicle it as it was happening.  The man is about as far from his caricature as you can get.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Alex and Roger,</p>

	<p>Just out of curiosity, have you actually, you know, read Michael Yon?  He&#8217;s about as far as you can get from an uncritical war booster.  For example, in 2005 when Diyala was going to s**t, he was one of the few people outside of some Knight-Ridder reporters to chronicle it as it was happening.  The man is about as far from his caricature as you can get.</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: dave heasman</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214860</link>
		<dc:creator>dave heasman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2007 22:10:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214860</guid>
		<description>A minute on Google tells us she ain&#039;t joshing. Here&#039;s her masterpiece from 2004 -

http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,3604,1328663,00.html


In Britain, America-bashing is so bad that I fear for my safety 

Carol Gould
Saturday October 16, 2004</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>A minute on Google tells us she ain&#8217;t joshing. Here&#8217;s her masterpiece from 2004 &#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,3604,1328663,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,3604,1328663,00.html</a></p>


	<p>In Britain, America-bashing is so bad that I fear for my safety</p>

	<p>Carol Gould<br />
Saturday October 16, 2004</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: novakant</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214856</link>
		<dc:creator>novakant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2007 21:44:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214856</guid>
		<description>As a public service announcement I will direct all interested Londoners to &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.london.gov.uk/cabwise/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this very useful service&lt;/a&gt; provided by the Metropolitan police. You send a text to a central number and they&#039;ll text you back with the numbers of one black cab and two licensed minicab services in the area you&#039;re in. Worked like charm when I had to get back from Homerton on a Saturday night. If you want to save around a third of the price choose a minicab.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>As a public service announcement I will direct all interested Londoners to <a href="http://www.london.gov.uk/cabwise/" rel="nofollow">this very useful service</a> provided by the Metropolitan police. You send a text to a central number and they&#8217;ll text you back with the numbers of one black cab and two licensed minicab services in the area you&#8217;re in. Worked like charm when I had to get back from Homerton on a Saturday night. If you want to save around a third of the price choose a minicab.</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: dave heasman</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/comment-page-1/#comment-214855</link>
		<dc:creator>dave heasman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2007 21:41:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/10/23/things-i-dont-understand/#comment-214855</guid>
		<description>jsm is indubitably on the ball. It&#039;s Carol Gould, haunter of hookah-festooned cafes and quaker in boots. She comments on the Graun just as &quot;Carol&quot; but the style is unique, thank God.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>jsm is indubitably on the ball. It&#8217;s Carol Gould, haunter of hookah-festooned cafes and quaker in boots. She comments on the Graun just as &#8220;Carol&#8221; but the style is unique, thank God.</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

