Comments on: Half a metaphor http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/ Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made Sun, 21 Mar 2010 07:41:53 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Timon http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-217003 Timon Tue, 06 Nov 2007 09:40:20 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-217003 There is an interesting conversation between Jon Udell and Mike Caulfield of BlueHampshire.com at <a href="http://feeds.conversationsnetwork.org/~r/gigavox/channel/itconversations/~3/175513249/detail3412.html" rel="nofollow">IT Conversations [26 Oct 07]</a>. I realized after listening that I had never really understood the difference between a non-commercial blog and traditional editorial. Basically he describes the process of bringing new people into the BlueHampshire project and dealing with their expectations, and in doing so makes a very lucid summary of new media and the knowledge necessary to work in them. There is an interesting conversation between Jon Udell and Mike Caulfield of BlueHampshire.com at IT Conversations [26 Oct 07]. I realized after listening that I had never really understood the difference between a non-commercial blog and traditional editorial. Basically he describes the process of bringing new people into the BlueHampshire project and dealing with their expectations, and in doing so makes a very lucid summary of new media and the knowledge necessary to work in them.

]]> By: Peter Clay http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216918 Peter Clay Mon, 05 Nov 2007 17:31:26 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216918 I'm surprised Seth F has not been along to remind you that it's not the writing, but the getting read, that matters. I’m surprised Seth F has not been along to remind you that it’s not the writing, but the getting read, that matters.

]]> By: JamesWalden http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216757 JamesWalden Sun, 04 Nov 2007 01:04:25 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216757 For "digital literacy," I'd like to see something that's not just about current trends like blogs, but that deals with the fundamentals of informatics that students will be able to use for the rest of their lives, i.e. something along the lines of Peter Denning's <a href="http://cs.gmu.edu/cne/pjd/GP/gp_overview.html" rel="nofollow">Great Principles of Computing</a> or <a href="http://csunplugged.com/" rel="nofollow">CS Unplugged</a> or CMU's <a href="http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~CompThink/" rel="nofollow">Computational Thinking</a> project For “digital literacy,” I’d like to see something that’s not just about current trends like blogs, but that deals with the fundamentals of informatics that students will be able to use for the rest of their lives, i.e. something along the lines of

Peter Denning’s Great Principles of Computing

or

CS Unplugged

or

CMU’s Computational Thinking project

]]> By: c.l. ball http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216260 c.l. ball Thu, 01 Nov 2007 21:20:14 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216260 But neither "open source" under the OSI definition nor "free software" under the FSF definition restricts the ability to charge for the software. I could offer Wordpress for sale if I wished to; I just could not restrict anyone from redistributing it freely or even more expensively. That is, I cannot condition the license on royalties or fees. These may be non-profit activities, but I'm not sure they are really non-market. The wiki work would be the major exception since it is mostly donation funded, and was created by Bomis without any apparent commercial purpose. But Wordpress and many others are created by venture capital-funded firms and have commercial affiliations. Wordpress in part -- but only in part -- makes Akismet have a greater purpose, and wordpress has limited enterprise level for-pay services. But neither “open source” under the OSI definition nor “free software” under the FSF definition restricts the ability to charge for the software. I could offer Wordpress for sale if I wished to; I just could not restrict anyone from redistributing it freely or even more expensively. That is, I cannot condition the license on royalties or fees.

These may be non-profit activities, but I’m not sure they are really non-market. The wiki work would be the major exception since it is mostly donation funded, and was created by Bomis without any apparent commercial purpose.

But Wordpress and many others are created by venture capital-funded firms and have commercial affiliations. Wordpress in part—but only in part—makes Akismet have a greater purpose, and wordpress has limited enterprise level for-pay services.

]]> By: Person http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216258 Person Thu, 01 Nov 2007 21:11:04 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216258 john_quiggin: I'm going to have to echo c._l._ball's comment. Something about the characterization "non-market" rubs me the wrong way. Generally speaking, you can find a pretty tremendous list of things that are "not-X" for any X. Why not call it "non-violent" innovation or "non-aquatic innovation" or "non-brick-and-mortar" innovation? It seems that when you group some things as "non-X", the implicit message is "and folks who support X would oppose this". But "pro-market" types don't, to my knowledge, want to restrict or even disparage wikis in any way. "Pro-market" people are more unified in their support of some specific set of property rights, which these technologies unambiguously rely on, unless you want to focus on those wikis that do no assert any legal rights over the servers they use. The servers, by the way, are purchased on a market, which IMHO makes the characterization even more questionable. john_quiggin: I’m going to have to echo c._l._ball’s comment. Something about the characterization “non-market” rubs me the wrong way. Generally speaking, you can find a pretty tremendous list of things that are “not-X” for any X. Why not call it “non-violent” innovation or “non-aquatic innovation” or “non-brick-and-mortar” innovation?

It seems that when you group some things as “non-X”, the implicit message is “and folks who support X would oppose this”. But “pro-market” types don’t, to my knowledge, want to restrict or even disparage wikis in any way. “Pro-market” people are more unified in their support of some specific set of property rights, which these technologies unambiguously rely on, unless you want to focus on those wikis that do no assert any legal rights over the servers they use.

The servers, by the way, are purchased on a market, which IMHO makes the characterization even more questionable.

]]> By: John Quiggin http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216254 John Quiggin Thu, 01 Nov 2007 19:58:27 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216254 "The software used to make blogs, wikis, etc. are products that are sold and have markets." Partially true at best. Nearly all wiki software and the most popular blog software (notably Wordpress) is open source, and this is increasingly true for browsers and other software used in reading. Much of what isn't open source is free. But the point about ads is important, as I noted a while back. “The software used to make blogs, wikis, etc. are products that are sold and have markets.”

Partially true at best. Nearly all wiki software and the most popular blog software (notably Wordpress) is open source, and this is increasingly true for browsers and other software used in reading. Much of what isn’t open source is free.

But the point about ads is important, as I noted a while back.

]]> By: Peter http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216213 Peter Thu, 01 Nov 2007 16:28:07 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216213 #5: 19th-century European literature was written primarily by men, yet read primarily by women. I think it is fair to say that women have traditionally been excluded from written culture (at least in the West). #5: 19th-century European literature was written primarily by men, yet read primarily by women. I think it is fair to say that women have traditionally been excluded from written culture (at least in the West).

]]> By: c.l. ball http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216205 c.l. ball Thu, 01 Nov 2007 15:39:31 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216205 Sort of off your bleg topic, but why the adjective "non-market"? The software used to make blogs, wikis, etc. are products that are sold and have markets. If you mean non-compensated, that's different. Though more and more blogs are taking adds. Thankfully, not this one. Sort of off your bleg topic, but why the adjective “non-market”? The software used to make blogs, wikis, etc. are products that are sold and have markets. If you mean non-compensated, that’s different. Though more and more blogs are taking adds. Thankfully, not this one.

]]> By: stostosto http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216196 stostosto Thu, 01 Nov 2007 14:28:33 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216196 jq I didn't imply that your mention was "controversial". I was simply baffled. I gather you take a very long view on the word "traditionally". OK then. jq

I didn’t imply that your mention was “controversial”. I was simply baffled. I gather you take a very long view on the word “traditionally”. OK then.

]]> By: Stuart http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216183 Stuart Thu, 01 Nov 2007 12:48:32 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216183 Isn't it the case that something like 90% of visitors to blogs, wikis, forums and the like don't contribute, they only read (and something like 1% of the visitors make the vast majority of comments/changes). I wonder how this factors into it - are certain groups less likely to participate still? Isn’t it the case that something like 90% of visitors to blogs, wikis, forums and the like don’t contribute, they only read (and something like 1% of the visitors make the vast majority of comments/changes). I wonder how this factors into it – are certain groups less likely to participate still?

]]> By: John Quiggin http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216178 John Quiggin Thu, 01 Nov 2007 11:36:30 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216178 #5, it's surely not controversial that women were traditionally excluded from written culture, and that this exclusion broke down (at different times in different places) with the spread of literacy. #5, it’s surely not controversial that women were traditionally excluded from written culture, and that this exclusion broke down (at different times in different places) with the spread of literacy.

]]> By: stostosto http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216173 stostosto Thu, 01 Nov 2007 10:38:32 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216173 <i>..groups (women, working people) traditionally excluded from written culture.</i> Women??? ..groups (women, working people) traditionally excluded from written culture.

Women???

]]> By: Chris Williams http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216172 Chris Williams Thu, 01 Nov 2007 09:44:28 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216172 People who study yr actual literacy are backlashing against the over-use of the phrase "______ literacy". See: Vincent, David (2003) 'Literacy Literacy' in Interchange, 34 http://oro.open.ac.uk/9709/ People who study yr actual literacy are backlashing against the over-use of the phrase “______ literacy”. See:
Vincent, David (2003) ‘Literacy Literacy’ in Interchange, 34 http://oro.open.ac.uk/9709/

]]> By: Quo Vadis http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216167 Quo Vadis Thu, 01 Nov 2007 08:55:33 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216167 It depends upon what you regard as ‘writing’. The types of writing you mention are more broadcast oriented - one producer can participate with potentially many millions of consumers whereas one consumer can participate with only as many producers as they can read regularly. If you extend the definition of ‘writing’ to include personal one-to-one or one-to-several communications like email and discussion groups, then your point may not hold. With regard to computer literacy, it is said that the spreadsheet was the “killer app” for the PC - that is the application that made the PC an indispensable tool. While that may have been true in the business environment, for the home user, the killer app would have to be the Internet. Before that, the PC was little more than a typewriter for most home users. It depends upon what you regard as ‘writing’.

The types of writing you mention are more broadcast oriented – one producer can participate with potentially many millions of consumers whereas one consumer can participate with only as many producers as they can read regularly.

If you extend the definition of ‘writing’ to include personal one-to-one or one-to-several communications like email and discussion groups, then your point may not hold.

With regard to computer literacy, it is said that the spreadsheet was the “killer app” for the PC - that is the application that made the PC an indispensable tool. While that may have been true in the business environment, for the home user, the killer app would have to be the Internet. Before that, the PC was little more than a typewriter for most home users.

]]> By: Felix http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/comment-page-1/#comment-216156 Felix Thu, 01 Nov 2007 02:11:50 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/01/half-a-metaphor/#comment-216156 I had a <a href="http://www.portfolio.com/views/blogs/market-movers/2007/07/11/whether-computers-can-help-poor-and-middle-income-countries" rel="nofollow">conversation with Charles Kenny on this subject</a> back in July, which has links to a few interesting papers. I had a conversation with Charles Kenny on this subject back in July, which has links to a few interesting papers.

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