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	<title>Comments on: If so many recipes can work, why do so many fail ?</title>
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	<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/</link>
	<description>Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made</description>
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		<title>By: abb1</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218297</link>
		<dc:creator>abb1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Nov 2007 22:57:12 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Just like it&#039;s often impossible to comprehend IMF and World Bank actions without deep understanding of the Washington Consensus, comrades, to appreciate North Korean achievements you obviously need to spend time studying the Juche idea - the new philosophical thought which centres on man.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Just like it&#8217;s often impossible to comprehend <span class="caps">IMF</span> and World Bank actions without deep understanding of the Washington Consensus, comrades, to appreciate North Korean achievements you obviously need to spend time studying the Juche idea &#8211; the new philosophical thought which centres on man.</p>
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		<title>By: nu</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218293</link>
		<dc:creator>nu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Nov 2007 20:51:27 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;i&gt; Oh, autarky is North Korea’s problem. Nothing to do with communism or stalinist dictatorship. &lt;/i&gt;

on top of being a stalinist dictatorship, it&#039;s in complete autarky.
that&#039;s probably why North Korea is worse than damn near everywhere on earth, including other communist/stalinist dictatorships.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i> Oh, autarky is North Korea&#8217;s problem. Nothing to do with communism or stalinist dictatorship. </i></p>

	<p>on top of being a stalinist dictatorship, it&#8217;s in complete autarky.<br />
that&#8217;s probably why North Korea is worse than damn near everywhere on earth, including other communist/stalinist dictatorships.</p>
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		<title>By: mugwump</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218292</link>
		<dc:creator>mugwump</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Nov 2007 20:17:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Second, some recipes really are bad, so bad that they have never been tried in the developed countries. Complete autarky, as implemented in North Korea, is an obvious example.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Oh, &lt;i&gt;autarky&lt;/i&gt; is North Korea&#039;s problem. Nothing to do with communism or stalinist dictatorship.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><blockquote>Second, some recipes really are bad, so bad that they have never been tried in the developed countries. Complete autarky, as implemented in North Korea, is an obvious example.</blockquote><br />
Oh, <i>autarky</i> is North Korea&#8217;s problem. Nothing to do with communism or stalinist dictatorship.</p>
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		<title>By: William Newman</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218266</link>
		<dc:creator>William Newman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Nov 2007 23:02:31 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Is it reasonable to equate protectionism at the level of the United States in the 19th century with protection in the Third World? I have travelled very little outside developed countries. But various times --- perhaps half a dozen times in person, another half a dozen times in print --- people have stories about how some cheap, very portable consumer good was a big hit. A Polaroid-style photo (of the local) was at the high end for cost and unportability, and writing implements were at the low end. Especially at the low end, it&#039;s pretty hard for me to believe that the locals didn&#039;t have enough to trade: even at $200/year a ballpoint pen is not unthinkably expensive. I don&#039;t know what the mechanism was --- just graft and banditry, perhaps --- but I don&#039;t see how useful knickknacks at that level could ever be a surprise unless the effective barriers to trade were off the scale, far higher than anything Smoot and Hawley dreamed of. People have told me to read the journals of Lewis and Clark (for other reasons) and when/if I get around to it I will be wondering whether they tell of useful knickknacks which somehow absolutely failed to make it into the interior.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Is it reasonable to equate protectionism at the level of the United States in the 19th century with protection in the Third World? I have travelled very little outside developed countries. But various times&#8212;- perhaps half a dozen times in person, another half a dozen times in print&#8212;- people have stories about how some cheap, very portable consumer good was a big hit. A Polaroid-style photo (of the local) was at the high end for cost and unportability, and writing implements were at the low end. Especially at the low end, it&#8217;s pretty hard for me to believe that the locals didn&#8217;t have enough to trade: even at $200/year a ballpoint pen is not unthinkably expensive. I don&#8217;t know what the mechanism was&#8212;- just graft and banditry, perhaps&#8212;- but I don&#8217;t see how useful knickknacks at that level could ever be a surprise unless the effective barriers to trade were off the scale, far higher than anything Smoot and Hawley dreamed of. People have told me to read the journals of Lewis and Clark (for other reasons) and when/if I get around to it I will be wondering whether they tell of useful knickknacks which somehow absolutely failed to make it into the interior.</p>
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		<title>By: dsquared</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218095</link>
		<dc:creator>dsquared</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 09:28:27 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;i&gt;I think we have to give the neoliberals a point on fiscal solvency and sound money&lt;/i&gt;

Sound money yes, (as long as it means the absence of hyperinflation rather than &quot;inflation nutterism&quot;).  But fiscal solvency seems very controversial indeed to me.  I&#039;d only sign up for a non-explosive path for the primary deficit as being a sensible minimum condition.  &quot;Fiscal solvency&quot; implies to me that governments shouldn&#039;t default on their debt, and in lots of cases I think they should.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>I think we have to give the neoliberals a point on fiscal solvency and sound money</i></p>

	<p>Sound money yes, (as long as it means the absence of hyperinflation rather than &#8220;inflation nutterism&#8221;).  But fiscal solvency seems very controversial indeed to me.  I&#8217;d only sign up for a non-explosive path for the primary deficit as being a sensible minimum condition.  &#8220;Fiscal solvency&#8221; implies to me that governments shouldn&#8217;t default on their debt, and in lots of cases I think they should.</p>
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		<title>By: abb1</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218067</link>
		<dc:creator>abb1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Nov 2007 22:42:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/#comment-218067</guid>
		<description>In my uneducated opinion there are no &#039;recipes&#039;, no experimentation. In every single country every single policy represents a compromise of all various interests involved. It&#039;s strictly deterministic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>In my uneducated opinion there are no &#8216;recipes&#8217;, no experimentation. In every single country every single policy represents a compromise of all various interests involved. It&#8217;s strictly deterministic.</p>
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		<title>By: nu</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218064</link>
		<dc:creator>nu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Nov 2007 22:01:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>With the real cases of Argentina, Zimbabwe, Venezuela and debates in Mexico, Brazil, parts of Africa and the EU, how are fiscal solvency and sound money points of mainly historical interest ?

When do propriety rights stop being secure and become unferrered ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>With the real cases of Argentina, Zimbabwe, Venezuela and debates in Mexico, Brazil, parts of Africa and the EU, how are fiscal solvency and sound money points of mainly historical interest ?</p>

	<p>When do propriety rights stop being secure and become unferrered ?</p>
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		<title>By: John Quiggin</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218062</link>
		<dc:creator>John Quiggin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Nov 2007 21:16:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/#comment-218062</guid>
		<description>I think we have to give the neoliberals a point on fiscal solvency and sound money. Although I don&#039;t think anyone has ever been opposed to these things, and they have been delivered under a wide range of institutional arrangements, people got rather blase about budget deficits and inflation towards the end of the long boom. In retrospect, this was not a good idea.

But that&#039;s a point that&#039;s of mainly historical interest. The big issue is property rights, and here DD is right on the money. What matters is secure property rights under the rule of law, not unfettered private property rights.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I think we have to give the neoliberals a point on fiscal solvency and sound money. Although I don&#8217;t think anyone has ever been opposed to these things, and they have been delivered under a wide range of institutional arrangements, people got rather blase about budget deficits and inflation towards the end of the long boom. In retrospect, this was not a good idea.</p>

	<p>But that&#8217;s a point that&#8217;s of mainly historical interest. The big issue is property rights, and here DD is right on the money. What matters is secure property rights under the rule of law, not unfettered private property rights.</p>
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		<title>By: nu</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218049</link>
		<dc:creator>nu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Nov 2007 17:01:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/#comment-218049</guid>
		<description>Is it appropriate to describe property rights, market-oriented incentives, sound money, fiscal solvency as neo-liberal things ?

&lt;i&gt; doesn’t this mean that we can already reject any development theories or policies which do not entail progress towards those (neo?) liberal things? &lt;/i&gt;

Well, &lt;i&gt; these principles have often been implemented via policy arrangements that are quite unconventional. &lt;/i&gt;
I guess that&#039;s a complicated issue. 
Land reforms, for instance are often viewed as attacks on propriety rights but it has been a way to establish markets and propriety rights in the past. However that would not mean that land reforms &lt;strong&gt; automatically &lt;/strong&gt; have those results.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Is it appropriate to describe property rights, market-oriented incentives, sound money, fiscal solvency as neo-liberal things ?</p>

	<p><i> doesn&#8217;t this mean that we can already reject any development theories or policies which do not entail progress towards those (neo?) liberal things? </i></p>

	<p>Well, <i> these principles have often been implemented via policy arrangements that are quite unconventional. </i><br />
I guess that&#8217;s a complicated issue.<br />
Land reforms, for instance are often viewed as attacks on propriety rights but it has been a way to establish markets and propriety rights in the past. However that would not mean that land reforms <strong> automatically </strong> have those results.</p>
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		<title>By: dsquared</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218030</link>
		<dc:creator>dsquared</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Nov 2007 12:43:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/#comment-218030</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;it is a necessary condition that we have those standard (neo-?) liberal things, markets, sound money, property rights etc&lt;/i&gt;

there ought to be a clue from the fact that China is a success story that &quot;minimal adherence&quot; is doing a lot of work here.  &quot;Property rights&quot; doesn&#039;t even necessarily mean &quot;individual property rights&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>it is a necessary condition that we have those standard (neo-?) liberal things, markets, sound money, property rights etc</i></p>

	<p>there ought to be a clue from the fact that China is a success story that &#8220;minimal adherence&#8221; is doing a lot of work here.  &#8220;Property rights&#8221; doesn&#8217;t even necessarily mean &#8220;individual property rights&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218027</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Nov 2007 12:26:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/#comment-218027</guid>
		<description>Perhaps, but the Worstall Dog Whistle Analyser (£10,000 from TYR Labs) next to me is flashing a red; the point here is how you define &quot;policies which do not entail progress towards these things&quot;, and anything which does not increase the rate of trachoma among the poor is going to be demonised by Timmeh by placing it outside this set.

Consider this a pre-emptive strawman burning.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Perhaps, but the Worstall Dog Whistle Analyser (&#163;10,000 from <span class="caps">TYR </span>Labs) next to me is flashing a red; the point here is how you define &#8220;policies which do not entail progress towards these things&#8221;, and anything which does not increase the rate of trachoma among the poor is going to be demonised by Timmeh by placing it outside this set.</p>

	<p>Consider this a pre-emptive strawman burning.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim Worstall</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-218019</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Worstall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Nov 2007 11:22:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/#comment-218019</guid>
		<description>The perils of living in rural Portugal: I&#039;m late with my copy of this. But there&#039;s one argument that&#039;s leaping out at me from just the first chapter:

&quot;In particular, first-order economic principles,- protection of property rights, contract enforcement, market-based competition, appropriate incentives, sound money, debt sustainability- do not map into unique policy prescriptions.&quot;

&quot;The Martian would recognize that the growth record is consistent with some of the &quot;higher-order&quot; economic principles that inspire the standard policy consensus. A semblance of property rights, sound money, fiscal solvency, market-oriented incentives- these are elements common to all successful gropwth strategies. Where they have been lacking, economic performance has been lackluster at best.&quot;

&quot;First, China relied on highly unusual, nonstandard institutions. Second, these unorthodox institutions worked precisely because they produced orthodox results, namely market- orientated incentives, property rights, macroeconomic stability , and so on.&quot;

&quot;In fact, principles such as appropriate incentives, property rights, sound money and fiscal solvency all come institution-free.&quot;

&quot;No country has experienced rapid growth without minimal adherence to what I have termed higher-order principles of sound economic governance-property rights, market-oriented incentives, sound money, fiscal solvency. But as I have already argued, these principles have often been implemented via policy arrangements that are quite unconventional.&quot;

That argument being that for the goal, development, to be reached it is a necessary condition that we have those standard (neo-?) liberal things, markets, sound money, property rights etc, but that there are many ways of reaching them. Obviously I&#039;ll find out more when I read the rest of the book, but doesn&#039;t this mean that we can already reject any development theories or policies which do not entail progress towards those (neo?) liberal things?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>The perils of living in rural Portugal: I&#8217;m late with my copy of this. But there&#8217;s one argument that&#8217;s leaping out at me from just the first chapter:</p>

	<p>&#8220;In particular, first-order economic principles,- protection of property rights, contract enforcement, market-based competition, appropriate incentives, sound money, debt sustainability- do not map into unique policy prescriptions.&#8221;</p>

	<p>&#8220;The Martian would recognize that the growth record is consistent with some of the &#8220;higher-order&#8221; economic principles that inspire the standard policy consensus. A semblance of property rights, sound money, fiscal solvency, market-oriented incentives- these are elements common to all successful gropwth strategies. Where they have been lacking, economic performance has been lackluster at best.&#8221;</p>

	<p>&#8220;First, China relied on highly unusual, nonstandard institutions. Second, these unorthodox institutions worked precisely because they produced orthodox results, namely market- orientated incentives, property rights, macroeconomic stability , and so on.&#8221;</p>

	<p>&#8220;In fact, principles such as appropriate incentives, property rights, sound money and fiscal solvency all come institution-free.&#8221;</p>

	<p>&#8220;No country has experienced rapid growth without minimal adherence to what I have termed higher-order principles of sound economic governance-property rights, market-oriented incentives, sound money, fiscal solvency. But as I have already argued, these principles have often been implemented via policy arrangements that are quite unconventional.&#8221;</p>

	<p>That argument being that for the goal, development, to be reached it is a necessary condition that we have those standard (neo-?) liberal things, markets, sound money, property rights etc, but that there are many ways of reaching them. Obviously I&#8217;ll find out more when I read the rest of the book, but doesn&#8217;t this mean that we can already reject any development theories or policies which do not entail progress towards those (neo?) liberal things?</p>
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		<title>By: John Quiggin</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-217994</link>
		<dc:creator>John Quiggin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Nov 2007 23:13:32 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Fixed now, thanks</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Fixed now, thanks</p>
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		<title>By: mollymooly</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2007/11/12/if-so-many-recipes-can-work-why-do-so-many-fail/comment-page-1/#comment-217989</link>
		<dc:creator>mollymooly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Nov 2007 22:29:27 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;i&gt;But the reversal of these &lt;b&gt;privatisations&lt;/b&gt; in the 1970s and 1980s...&lt;/i&gt;
You mean &lt;i&gt;the reversal of these &lt;b&gt;nationalisations&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/i&gt;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>But the reversal of these <b>privatisations</b> in the 1970s and 1980s&#8230;</i><br />
You mean <i>the reversal of these <b>nationalisations</b></i>?</p>
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