Comments on: Liberal Fascism: Wings Over the World Edition http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/ Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made Sun, 08 Nov 2009 12:38:18 -0800 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Heavy is the Hand of H.G. Wells, pt 1 « zunguzungu http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-226209 Heavy is the Hand of H.G. Wells, pt 1 « zunguzungu Wed, 30 Jan 2008 00:58:12 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-226209 [...] by zunguzungu on January 30, 2008 This 1936 film is Things to Come. And it’s exactly as incoherently bombastic and grandiose as it sounds. Not only is the main [...] [...] by zunguzungu on January 30, 2008 This 1936 film is Things to Come. And it’s exactly as incoherently bombastic and grandiose as it sounds. Not only is the main [...]

]]> By: engels http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-226111 engels Tue, 29 Jan 2008 11:53:46 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-226111 <i>About most affairs there can be no two respectable and antagonistic opinions ... It is nonsense to pretend there can be. There is one sole right way and there are endless wrong ways of doing things. A government is trying to go the right way or it is criminal.</i> Sounds like he's a US-style "libertarian"... About most affairs there can be no two respectable and antagonistic opinions … It is nonsense to pretend there can be. There is one sole right way and there are endless wrong ways of doing things. A government is trying to go the right way or it is criminal.

Sounds like he’s a US-style “libertarian”…

]]> By: Righteous Bubba http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-226081 Righteous Bubba Tue, 29 Jan 2008 00:52:53 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-226081 <a href="http://lefarkins.blogspot.com/2008/01/dear-jonah-i-am-not-serious-either.html" rel="nofollow">Our Jonah pwned again.</a> Our Jonah pwned again.

]]> By: libarbarian http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-226077 libarbarian Mon, 28 Jan 2008 23:11:31 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-226077 For those who are interested - the Wells novel on which the movie is based is <a href="http://etext.library.adelaide.edu.au/w/wells/hg/w45th/" rel="nofollow">"The Shape of Things to Come"</a> There certainly are some parts that turn my stomach - and I've just glanced through it. For instance, some quotes from the man who is portrayed as the Architect of the future state: 1. “It is no good asking people what they want,” wrote De Windt. “That is the error of democracy. You have first to think out what they ought to want if society is to be saved. Then you have to tell them what they want and see that they get it.” 2. Criticize,” he wrote, “yes, but do not obstruct.” If a directive organization is fundamentally bad, he taught, break it and throw it away, but rid your minds altogether of a conception of see-saw and give and take as a proper method in human affairs. 3. All this tangle of ideas had to be swept aside. “About most affairs there can be no two respectable and antagonistic opinions,” said De Windt. “It is nonsense to pretend there can be. There is one sole right way and there are endless wrong ways of doing things. A government is trying to go the right way or it is criminal. Sabotage must cease. It has always been one of the ugliest vices of advanced movements. It is a fundamental social vice.” YUCK!!!! For those who are interested – the Wells novel on which the movie is based is “The Shape of Things to Come”

There certainly are some parts that turn my stomach – and I’ve just glanced through it.

For instance, some quotes from the man who is portrayed as the Architect of the future state:

1. “It is no good asking people what they want,” wrote De Windt. “That is the error of democracy. You have first to think out what they ought to want if society is to be saved. Then you have to tell them what they want and see that they get it.”

2. Criticize,” he wrote, “yes, but do not obstruct.” If a directive organization is fundamentally bad, he taught, break it and throw it away, but rid your minds altogether of a conception of see-saw and give and take as a proper method in human affairs.

3. All this tangle of ideas had to be swept aside. “About most affairs there can be no two respectable and antagonistic opinions,” said De Windt. “It is nonsense to pretend there can be. There is one sole right way and there are endless wrong ways of doing things. A government is trying to go the right way or it is criminal. Sabotage must cease. It has always been one of the ugliest vices of advanced movements. It is a fundamental social vice.”

YUCK!

]]> By: seth edenbaum http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-226032 seth edenbaum Mon, 28 Jan 2008 14:12:16 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-226032 I led you to the door but I guess I'll have to walk you through it too. "What is your whole darn point anyway?" Liberal technocrats' contempt for democracy I led you to the door but I guess I’ll have to walk you through it too.

“What is your whole darn point anyway?”

Liberal technocrats’ contempt for democracy

]]> By: bi http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-226022 bi Mon, 28 Jan 2008 11:54:32 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-226022 seth edenbaum: "I've earned the right to be bitter." How? By growing up around lawyers and not engineers? What is your whole darn point anyway? Do you actually have one? seth edenbaum:

“I’ve earned the right to be bitter.”

How? By growing up around lawyers and not engineers?

What is your whole darn point anyway? Do you actually have one?

]]> By: engels http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-226018 engels Mon, 28 Jan 2008 09:47:50 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-226018 <i>Tell me if you agree with Reich that the restructuring of the American economy into what we have today has been a “natural” process.</i> No. <i>Af if that’s the case tell me, is economics a “natural” science?</i> No. <i>And is the move towards the privatization in economic policy as “natural” a process as natural selection?</i> No. <i>Is Judt akin to a creationist for arguing the point.?</i> No. Tell me if you agree with Reich that the restructuring of the American economy into what we have today has been a “natural” process.

No.

Af if that’s the case tell me, is economics a “natural” science?

No.

And is the move towards the privatization in economic policy as “natural” a process as natural selection?

No.

Is Judt akin to a creationist for arguing the point.?

No.

]]> By: abb1 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-226016 abb1 Mon, 28 Jan 2008 08:41:18 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-226016 On the second thought, you're right - why not be bitter? It's a good style, interesting to read, elicits interesting reactions. Never mind. On the second thought, you’re right – why not be bitter? It’s a good style, interesting to read, elicits interesting reactions. Never mind.

]]> By: seth edenbaum http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-225988 seth edenbaum Mon, 28 Jan 2008 03:32:33 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-225988 Here's more: a discussion of corporate philanthropy and <a href="http://uchicagolaw.typepad.com/faculty/2008/01/anup-malani-pod.html" rel="nofollow">"warm glow"</a> "The talk will discuss the competitive advantage of corporations over charities and the government, and the importance of tax law in determining how consumers purchase warm glow from corporations." "Scientists" discussing the nature order of things? But nature isn't a democratic system. And neither is google. Here’s more: a discussion of corporate philanthropy and “warm glow”
“The talk will discuss the competitive advantage of corporations over charities and the government, and the importance of tax law in determining how consumers purchase warm glow from corporations.”
“Scientists” discussing the nature order of things?
But nature isn’t a democratic system. And neither is google.

]]> By: seth edenbaum http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-225971 seth edenbaum Sun, 27 Jan 2008 23:50:00 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-225971 Engels, read Tony Judt. Tell me if you agree with Reich that the restructuring of the American economy into what we have today has been a "natural" process. Af if that's the case tell me, is economics a "natural" science? <b>And is the move towards the privatization in economic policy as "natural" a process as natural selection? Is Judt akin to a creationist for arguing the point.?</b> DeLong certainly treats him like one. I'm not more bitter than Judt, who wrote <a href="http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n18/judt01_.html" rel="nofollow">Bush’s Useful Idiots: The Strange Death of Liberal America</a> or here, on Israel: <a href="http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/711997.html" rel="nofollow">The country that wouldn't grow up</a> I've earned the right to be bitter, Engels, read Tony Judt. Tell me if you agree with Reich that the restructuring of the American economy into what we have today has been a “natural” process. Af if that’s the case tell me, is economics a “natural” science? And is the move towards the privatization in economic policy as “natural” a process as natural selection? Is Judt akin to a creationist for arguing the point.? DeLong certainly treats him like one.

I’m not more bitter than Judt, who wrote Bush’s Useful Idiots: The Strange Death of Liberal America
or here, on Israel: The country that wouldn’t grow up

I’ve earned the right to be bitter,

]]> By: engels http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-225942 engels Sun, 27 Jan 2008 11:08:05 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-225942 <i>Adversarialism is not the government of reason but of <b>structured debate</b></i> (Seth Edenbaum) Irony is indeed dead. Adversarialism is not the government of reason but of structured debate (Seth Edenbaum)

Irony is indeed dead.

]]> By: seth edenbaum http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-225929 seth edenbaum Sun, 27 Jan 2008 06:04:59 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-225929 <a href="http://dneiwert.blogspot.com/search?q=Foucault" rel="nofollow">This</a> is odd. This is odd.

]]> By: P http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-225916 P Sun, 27 Jan 2008 01:21:15 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-225916 The <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_Fascism" rel="nofollow"> Wikipedia article on Goldberg's book</a> is currently an supportive uncritical stub. Anybody want to add to it? The Wikipedia article on Goldberg’s book is currently an supportive uncritical stub. Anybody want to add to it?

]]> By: Uncle Kvetch http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-225903 Uncle Kvetch Sat, 26 Jan 2008 22:37:57 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-225903 <i>everybody should be happy, no bitterness necessary</i> Take away the bitterness and I'm not sure Seth would have anything to comment about. everybody should be happy, no bitterness necessary

Take away the bitterness and I’m not sure Seth would have anything to comment about.

]]> By: abb1 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/comment-page-2/#comment-225897 abb1 Sat, 26 Jan 2008 20:41:59 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/2008/01/24/liberal-fascism-wings-over-the-world-edition/#comment-225897 I don't understand why it is wrong for collaborationist elite of academia to say their piece in this adversarial democracy thing? Everyone is a product of their environment, so why do you demand that John Holbo, card-carrying member of technocratic elites, should rise above his nature and act like someone else? John gives his perspective, you give yours, everybody should be happy, no bitterness necessary. I don’t understand why it is wrong for collaborationist elite of academia to say their piece in this adversarial democracy thing? Everyone is a product of their environment, so why do you demand that John Holbo, card-carrying member of technocratic elites, should rise above his nature and act like someone else? John gives his perspective, you give yours, everybody should be happy, no bitterness necessary.

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