Comments on: The spread and tweaking (?) of misinformation http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/ Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made Mon, 13 Feb 2012 10:56:07 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Scott http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249653 Scott Fri, 15 Aug 2008 13:19:40 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249653 Just compare the coverage of Microsoft Virtual Earth and Google Maps and you will find many differences in coverage. c.l. ball, just look at the copyright in the and you will find out who the map suppliers are. Just compare the coverage of Microsoft Virtual Earth and Google Maps and you will find many differences in coverage.

c.l. ball, just look at the copyright in the and you will find out who the map suppliers are.

]]> By: OriGuy http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249624 OriGuy Thu, 14 Aug 2008 19:32:39 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249624 There is some information at multimap.com. The cities and towns in Georgia are shown, with at least some street information. The data comes from Microsoft VirtualEarth, which I suspect isn't available to Google. The data definitely isn't as complete as for the UK, which is where multimap is based. There is some information at multimap.com. The cities and towns in Georgia are shown, with at least some street information. The data comes from Microsoft VirtualEarth, which I suspect isn’t available to Google.
The data definitely isn’t as complete as for the UK, which is where multimap is based.

]]> By: Tom T. http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249622 Tom T. Thu, 14 Aug 2008 19:18:30 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249622 Re: 38. If you think that's odd, consider: Areas 1-50 aren't listed AT ALL! Re: 38. If you think that’s odd, consider: Areas 1-50 aren’t listed AT ALL!

]]> By: Richard Zach http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249618 Richard Zach Thu, 14 Aug 2008 18:07:14 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249618 I travelled to both Tblisi and Yerevan last year. While I won't swear that Tblisi and Yerevan didn't show up at least as dots on Google Maps, I do remember that I looked at both in GM (as I usually do, print maps of the hotel and surrounding areas before the trip etc) and was surprised to see that there was no detail in the maps at all. I travelled to both Tblisi and Yerevan last year. While I won’t swear that Tblisi and Yerevan didn’t show up at least as dots on Google Maps, I do remember that I looked at both in GM (as I usually do, print maps of the hotel and surrounding areas before the trip etc) and was surprised to see that there was no detail in the maps at all.

]]> By: MDP http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249615 MDP Thu, 14 Aug 2008 17:34:22 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249615 <i>While Google may do all sorts of things that annoy various constituencies, it has been quite consistent in not wanting to block information even when people’s preference is that it would do so ...</i> It looks like Google <a href="http://gregransom.com/prestopundit/2008/07/this-may-explain.html" rel="nofollow">removed the blogger PrestoPundit</a> from their index after he started writing "omg Obama's dad was a socialist" posts. <a href="http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=prestopundit&btnG=Google+Search" rel="nofollow">270k hits for "PrestoPundit,"</a> but none go directly to his site. Could that be caused by a technical glitch? If you check <a href="http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=prestopundit&fr=yfp-t-501&toggle=1&cop=mss&ei=UTF-8" rel="nofollow">Yahoo</a>, the first hits for "PrestoPundit" and "Greg Ransom" naturally go directly to the guy's blog. While Google may do all sorts of things that annoy various constituencies, it has been quite consistent in not wanting to block information even when people’s preference is that it would do so …

It looks like Google removed the blogger PrestoPundit from their index after he started writing “omg Obama’s dad was a socialist” posts. 270k hits for “PrestoPundit,” but none go directly to his site. Could that be caused by a technical glitch?

If you check Yahoo, the first hits for “PrestoPundit” and “Greg Ransom” naturally go directly to the guy’s blog.

]]> By: engels http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249608 engels Thu, 14 Aug 2008 15:01:39 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249608 <a href="http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=area+51&ie=UTF8&ll=37.243448,-116.334229&spn=1.738194,3.515625&z=9" rel="nofollow">More importantly</a> More importantly

]]> By: lemuel pitkin http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249606 lemuel pitkin Thu, 14 Aug 2008 14:53:09 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249606 <i>How do you explain the presence of material for Iraq/Iran. Afghanistan/Pakistan</i> Not to mention Kashmir, Tibet, etc. <i>Sorry, dude, it doesn’t work.</i> Yeah, I've sort of reached that conclusion myself. How do you explain the presence of material for

Iraq/Iran.
Afghanistan/Pakistan

Not to mention Kashmir, Tibet, etc.

Sorry, dude, it doesn’t work.

Yeah, I’ve sort of reached that conclusion myself.

]]> By: c.l. ball http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249603 c.l. ball Thu, 14 Aug 2008 14:09:23 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249603 Does anyone know how Google obtains the data for their maps? Cyprus is blank but there is data for Somalia and Western Sahara, so territorial disputes don't preclude mapping. Does anyone know how Google obtains the data for their maps? Cyprus is blank but there is data for Somalia and Western Sahara, so territorial disputes don’t preclude mapping.

]]> By: Eszter Hargittai http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249601 Eszter Hargittai Thu, 14 Aug 2008 13:39:55 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249601 Novakant, I agree with you that one shouldn’t always just take a company’s statement at face value. However, given the particulars here, it doesn’t seem like it would be worth it for Google to lie and lose its reputation over this. It would be too easy for people to have proof of a more detailed map in the past. Plenty of people take screen shots of maps and such, chances are there would be such maps floating out there. Why risk the company’s reputation over this? Novakant, I agree with you that one shouldn’t always just take a company’s statement at face value. However, given the particulars here, it doesn’t seem like it would be worth it for Google to lie and lose its reputation over this. It would be too easy for people to have proof of a more detailed map in the past. Plenty of people take screen shots of maps and such, chances are there would be such maps floating out there. Why risk the company’s reputation over this?

]]> By: novakant http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249569 novakant Thu, 14 Aug 2008 05:55:57 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249569 On reflection I have to qualify my earlier point that the data on Georgia was available on Google maps, as I also used Google Earth to get data on the region and cannot remember for sure which depicted what. That said, I find it a bit odd that a statement of a company is taken at face value and considered as proof that definitely clears up the matter, while users who report otherwise are dismissed out of hand. Sure, the internet is full of conspiracy nuts, but it's not as if companies always tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. On reflection I have to qualify my earlier point that the data on Georgia was available on Google maps, as I also used Google Earth to get data on the region and cannot remember for sure which depicted what. That said, I find it a bit odd that a statement of a company is taken at face value and considered as proof that definitely clears up the matter, while users who report otherwise are dismissed out of hand. Sure, the internet is full of conspiracy nuts, but it’s not as if companies always tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

]]> By: Tom T. http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249567 Tom T. Thu, 14 Aug 2008 04:12:53 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249567 Lemuel, on that spreadsheet you linked to, I don't see Georgia at all. Am I missing something? Also, when I type "Georgia" into Google Maps, all it gives me is the US state. The only way I can get to the country is by searching for Armenia or some other neighboring nation. Is anyone else having this happen? Mapquest has a listing for Georgia and limited road maps, but no satellite imagery. Lemuel, on that spreadsheet you linked to, I don’t see Georgia at all. Am I missing something?

Also, when I type “Georgia” into Google Maps, all it gives me is the US state. The only way I can get to the country is by searching for Armenia or some other neighboring nation. Is anyone else having this happen?

Mapquest has a listing for Georgia and limited road maps, but no satellite imagery.

]]> By: cpareader http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249564 cpareader Thu, 14 Aug 2008 03:36:03 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249564 re @31, don't be disturbed. the BBC world service I hear on a local NPR station was reporting on the Georgia invasion of S. Ossetia (and being anxious about it in the way of BBC reporters) several hours before Russia made a move on Georgia, even before Russian troops showed up in S. Ossetia. I don't know where you live, but I live in California, and hear the BBC regularly in the middle of the night our time, about seven, or perhaps eight, depending on Daylight Savings Time, hours earlier than Greenwich Mean Time. re @31, don’t be disturbed. the BBC world service I hear on a local NPR station was reporting on the Georgia invasion of S. Ossetia (and being anxious about it in the way of BBC reporters) several hours before Russia made a move on Georgia, even before Russian troops showed up in S. Ossetia. I don’t know where you live, but I live in California, and hear the BBC regularly in the middle of the night our time, about seven, or perhaps eight, depending on Daylight Savings Time, hours earlier than Greenwich Mean Time.

]]> By: bicycle Hussein paladin http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249563 bicycle Hussein paladin Thu, 14 Aug 2008 02:46:05 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249563 OT, but what disturbs me most about the coverage of this war is that I had not heard a peep about Georgia's attacks on S Ossetia until Russia started attacking Georgia. I listen to NPR and read the Guardian regularly. That's pretty disappointing for military action like that to be completely ignored (or so it seemed to me). Am I wrong about this? Did anyone hear about Georgia's actions in S Ossetia from British or US news outlets before Russia started attacking Georgia? OT, but what disturbs me most about the coverage of this war is that I had not heard a peep about Georgia’s attacks on S Ossetia until Russia started attacking Georgia. I listen to NPR and read the Guardian regularly. That’s pretty disappointing for military action like that to be completely ignored (or so it seemed to me). Am I wrong about this? Did anyone hear about Georgia’s actions in S Ossetia from British or US news outlets before Russia started attacking Georgia?

]]> By: Righteous Bubba http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249557 Righteous Bubba Thu, 14 Aug 2008 01:07:37 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249557 <i>Google Earth works just fine</i> And boy, the YouTube links tied to location are pretty cool. Google Earth works just fine

And boy, the YouTube links tied to location are pretty cool.

]]> By: Miguel http://crookedtimber.org/2008/08/13/the-spread-and-tweaking-of-misinformation/comment-page-1/#comment-249556 Miguel Thu, 14 Aug 2008 01:07:04 +0000 http://crookedtimber.org/?p=7393#comment-249556 I dated and remain friends with a producer for large market, local, TV news show. Just about weekly he would come home with stories about the other writers and producers finding a great story on a blog and not properly checking its source. When he would object he would usually get met with lectures about how mainstream media was scooped on the Trent Lott/Strom Thurmond affair and about how they had to be flexible and quick acting to survive. That attitude fails to realize that most blogs get their information from mainstream media when the media keeps a personal blog as a source (or checks wikipedia) it creates a framework wherein the disemination of misinformation is easy and dangerous. Journalists, even online journalists really must demand to get to the initial source of a story before running with it. They should have started with a call to Google who would have easily explained the absence or at least found archived photos of the maps that supposedly had all of the information. I worry that the instant reciprocity between respected media outlets will one day be used against the public by a savvy leader. I dated and remain friends with a producer for large market, local, TV news show. Just about weekly he would come home with stories about the other writers and producers finding a great story on a blog and not properly checking its source. When he would object he would usually get met with lectures about how mainstream media was scooped on the Trent Lott/Strom Thurmond affair and about how they had to be flexible and quick acting to survive.

That attitude fails to realize that most blogs get their information from mainstream media when the media keeps a personal blog as a source (or checks wikipedia) it creates a framework wherein the disemination of misinformation is easy and dangerous.

Journalists, even online journalists really must demand to get to the initial source of a story before running with it. They should have started with a call to Google who would have easily explained the absence or at least found archived photos of the maps that supposedly had all of the information.

I worry that the instant reciprocity between respected media outlets will one day be used against the public by a savvy leader.

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