Comments on: Eileen Flynn has died

By: John Smyth

John Smyth — Mon, 15 Sep 2008 11:56:48 +0000

Fintan O’Toole made the point on Irish radio yesterday that the law that allowed Eileen to be fired are still in force today [Equality Law don’t apply to religious schools].

By: Big Jim

Big Jim — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 21:27:12 +0000

Eileen taught our son last year and a happier year at school he hadn’t had before. When we met Eileen at the parent/teacher meeting we found her sociable,chatty and down to earth.

We live in New Ross and I well remember the set to with the nuns. At the time I thought where is the ethos of christianity in the church. “Let he/she who is without sin cast the first stone” Boy did time show us: The Ferns Report Rest in peace Eileen.

By: Dave

Dave — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 17:44:17 +0000

I see: going to church = inalienable right! Earning a living = not so fast, bucko!

By: SamChevre

SamChevre — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 17:39:59 +0000

SamChevre’s response suggests he is fine with the current government of Saudi Arabia and the former government of Afghanistan – i.e. the Taliban, absent their foreign policy.

Say WHAT?

I’m fine with them refusing to hire Christians. I’m not certain how that translates to, I’m fine with them denying Christians freedom of worship.

By: franck

franck — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 16:53:34 +0000

SamChevre’s response suggests he is fine with the current government of Saudi Arabia and the former government of Afghanistan – i.e. the Taliban, absent their foreign policy.

By: franck

franck — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 16:49:33 +0000

How are gaelscoileanna changing the religious basis of most schooling in Ireland? My understanding is that most of them are not sectarian. Is that true?

By: Martin Wisse

Martin Wisse — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 16:19:00 +0000

Suuure you are.

Obnoxious little turd.

By: SamChevre

SamChevre — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 15:13:21 +0000

A hypo for you: you’re a surgeon at a hospital that is funded by the state. For whatever reason the state has entrusted the governance of the hospital (and most other hospitals) to a body of Muslim scholars. When it becomes apparent to them that you eat pork, they fire you. Do you find that acceptable?

Adding three facts to make the cases more comparable, yes, certainly.

Those facts are “almost entirely funded by the state”, “the state is majority-Muslim”, and “these rules were in place when I started.”

Without the three facts, I’d say, yes, probably.

By: Lex

Lex — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 15:00:40 +0000

Re. boycott/employment – not least of the differences is that the latter involves a pre-existent contractual relationship, which in MOST developed countries includes by statute protections against dismissal for arbitrary/non-work-related “reasons”/excuses for petty vindictiveness…

This is because in MOST developed countries it has come to be recognised that individuals are dependent on employment in a way that employers are not dependent on any individual worker, and that therefore justice requires a certain rebalancing. I am aware that this is not a view universally shared; however, I do not care.

I further note that even in SOME developed countries that do not share these views, it remains illegal to “boycott” customers, for example, on the grounds of the colour of their skin, so the underlying principle – that not every aspect of an economic transaction is purely a matter of private, unchallengeable, choice – is not unknown.

By: Mrs Tilton

Mrs Tilton — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 14:46:37 +0000

SamChevre @11 & 15,

the ability to refuse to associate with … people who act in wrong ways

I’ll be charitable here, assuming that you meant “people who one believes act in wrong ways” and do not really believe that the villain of this piece was Eileen Flynn.

What’s the difference between a boycott generally (refusing to buy anything from someone) and refusal to buy work from someone?

Maybe your bafflement would be helped by considering the nature of the employer in this case. A hypo for you: you’re a surgeon at a hospital that is funded by the state. For whatever reason the state has entrusted the governance of the hospital (and most other hospitals) to a body of Muslim scholars. When it becomes apparent to them that you eat pork, they fire you. Do you find that acceptable? If you don’t, how do you distinguish your case from Flynn’s?

By: rossonian

rossonian — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 13:46:33 +0000

I’ve just come from Eileen Flynns funeral where ironically she’s been buried beside the Holy Faith School. We’d been friends for many years. Such an articulate and intelligent woman – the kind of company you’d relish over a pint of the black stuff. Her fondness for Leonard Cohen, who she saw recently in Kilmainham will never be forgotten and Bird on a Wire ushered her down the aisle to her final resting place carried on the shoulders of her beloved sons and husband Richie. She often boasted that in a concert in the seventies Leonard kissed her hand!
Simon Kennedy her legal representative in the 80’s spoke very highly of her and rightly so on the pulpit at the end of her funeral mass. The hymns were sang by the CBS boys choir from the school where she was teaching for the last seven years.
Her fondness for darts was legendary and she was buried with her arrows in her pocket. You could always find her at the oche in Roches on the quay any night ready for a challenge.
The town of New Ross is still in shock and Roches on the quay will never be the same again. I loved her and will miss her very much.

By: SamChevre

SamChevre — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 13:17:42 +0000

Lex,

I’m genuinely baffled (this isn’t a rhetorical question). What’s the difference between a boycott generally (refusing to buy anything from someone) and refusal to buy work from someone?

By: Lex

Lex — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 07:33:20 +0000

A boycott [good old Irish term] is a boycott, even when it’s done by people you disagree with. The difference between that and being dismissed by your employer for doing things that are neither illegal nor dangerous is evident, I would have thought.

By: PersonFromPorlock

PersonFromPorlock — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 00:16:30 +0000

The ability to deprive people who don’t conform to local mores of their livelihood is likely to become a dangerous and pernicious form of social control, as it did in Ireland for most of the last century.

IIRC, that was pretty much how it worked in the Soviet Union. So, not necessarily a new or a rightwing phenomenon.

By: Watson Aname

Watson Aname — Thu, 11 Sep 2008 21:24:10 +0000

The ability to deprive people who don’t conform to local mores of their livelihood is likely to become a dangerous and pernicious form of social control

`likely to’ or `almost certain to’? The latter seems more likely to me.