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	<title>Comments on: A bubble in the humanities?</title>
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	<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/</link>
	<description>Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 13 Feb 2012 07:27:13 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Salient</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289889</link>
		<dc:creator>Salient</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Sep 2009 16:06:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289889</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;where do you get the impression that the author is slandering (or even knows about) persistent (co)homology, barcodes, and the like? After several readings, I couldn’t convince myself that he was.&lt;/i&gt;

Yeah, your point (especially the parenthetical) is probably correct. If not that study, though -- which, you&#039;ll be happy to hear, was the controversial topic du jour around here a few months ago -- it&#039;s not clear what he &lt;i&gt;was&lt;/i&gt; cracking about.

(For those interested in the research in question, which is quite wonderful, see &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.stat.wisc.edu/~mchung/papers/IPMI.2009.pdf&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;. Prepare your &quot;model the cow as a perfect sphere&quot; jokes in anticipation of Figure 2!)

&lt;i&gt;You know, first they ignore you, then they mock you, then they co-opt your ideas into a musical number on the Brady Bunch Variety Hour. As far as I can tell, no one in my little sub-field has been denounced in the popular media, so it’d be great to get this stuff rolling.&lt;/i&gt;

Say, you&#039;ve got a point...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>where do you get the impression that the author is slandering (or even knows about) persistent (co)homology, barcodes, and the like? After several readings, I couldn&#8217;t convince myself that he was.</i></p>

	<p>Yeah, your point (especially the parenthetical) is probably correct. If not that study, though&#8212;which, you&#8217;ll be happy to hear, was the controversial topic du jour around here a few months ago&#8212;it&#8217;s not clear what he <i>was</i> cracking about.</p>

	<p>(For those interested in the research in question, which is quite wonderful, see <a href="http://www.stat.wisc.edu/~mchung/papers/IPMI.2009.pdf" rel="nofollow">here</a>. Prepare your &#8220;model the cow as a perfect sphere&#8221; jokes in anticipation of Figure 2!)</p>

	<p><i>You know, first they ignore you, then they mock you, then they co-opt your ideas into a musical number on the Brady Bunch Variety Hour. As far as I can tell, no one in my little sub-field has been denounced in the popular media, so it&#8217;d be great to get this stuff rolling.</i></p>

	<p>Say, you&#8217;ve got a point&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Henry</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289679</link>
		<dc:creator>Henry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:17:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289679</guid>
		<description>bq. One of the critical factors in maintaining the UK as a global media hub is that we’ve got a very discerning and sophisticated domestic market indeed. It’s kind of like having gastronomy on the curriculum in Lyons; the aim would be to perpetuate a regional cultural strength. Adam Smith, iirc, claimed that the ins and outs of cutlery-making were practically normal conversation in public-houses in Sheffield, and I think there’s a definite benefit in having conversations about irony, cultural appropriation and the social role of the media being standard pub-table fodder in Soho).

There&#039;s a business professor called Amar Bhide who has made this basic argument (sophisticated consumer markets as an important source of comparative advantage) at somewhat tedious length (the book is called The Venturesome Economy and has some 500 pages as best as I recall; the argument and real evidence could be summarized nicely in a 30 page pamphlet).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<blockquote>One of the critical factors in maintaining the UK as a global media hub is that we&#8217;ve got a very discerning and sophisticated domestic market indeed. It&#8217;s kind of like having gastronomy on the curriculum in Lyons; the aim would be to perpetuate a regional cultural strength. Adam Smith, iirc, claimed that the ins and outs of cutlery-making were practically normal conversation in public-houses in Sheffield, and I think there&#8217;s a definite benefit in having conversations about irony, cultural appropriation and the social role of the media being standard pub-table fodder in Soho).</blockquote>

	<p>There&#8217;s a business professor called Amar Bhide who has made this basic argument (sophisticated consumer markets as an important source of comparative advantage) at somewhat tedious length (the book is called The Venturesome Economy and has some 500 pages as best as I recall; the argument and real evidence could be summarized nicely in a 30 page pamphlet).</p>
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		<title>By: derek</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289594</link>
		<dc:creator>derek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Sep 2009 08:53:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289594</guid>
		<description>Well, at least he&#039;s making a falsifiable prediction that will come due in the near term. To say there is a &quot;bubble&quot; in some stock amounts to saying it is overvalued and there will soon be a correction. If there isn&#039;t a correction soon, then it wasn&#039;t overvalued, and there wasn&#039;t a bubble.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Well, at least he&#8217;s making a falsifiable prediction that will come due in the near term. To say there is a &#8220;bubble&#8221; in some stock amounts to saying it is overvalued and there will soon be a correction. If there isn&#8217;t a correction soon, then it wasn&#8217;t overvalued, and there wasn&#8217;t a bubble.</p>
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		<title>By: Billikin</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289522</link>
		<dc:creator>Billikin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Sep 2009 00:48:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289522</guid>
		<description>How can you have a bubble in the humanities? At least as far as content is concerned? Aren&#039;t new and interesting interpretations the -- beg pardon -- meat and potatoes of the humanities? Aren&#039;t the sands always shifting, so that there is no bedrock basis for evaluation? To be sure, viewpoints and schools of  thought come and go, and I suppose that some of them go like the One Hoss Shay, which could be called a crash. But as far as the humanities as a whole go, can creative insight be very overvalued?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>How can you have a bubble in the humanities? At least as far as content is concerned? Aren&#8217;t new and interesting interpretations the&#8212;beg pardon&#8212;meat and potatoes of the humanities? Aren&#8217;t the sands always shifting, so that there is no bedrock basis for evaluation? To be sure, viewpoints and schools of  thought come and go, and I suppose that some of them go like the One Hoss Shay, which could be called a crash. But as far as the humanities as a whole go, can creative insight be very overvalued?</p>
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		<title>By: Keir</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289517</link>
		<dc:creator>Keir</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Sep 2009 23:51:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289517</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;I didn’t believe him though.&lt;/i&gt;

Why not? After all, no one would dispute that Fry and Greenberg and so-on have had serious influence on painting; why is it odd to think that the same applies to film and television?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>I didn&#8217;t believe him though.</i></p>

	<p>Why not? After all, no one would dispute that Fry and Greenberg and so-on have had serious influence on painting; why is it odd to think that the same applies to film and television?</p>
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		<title>By: John Quiggin</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289514</link>
		<dc:creator>John Quiggin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Sep 2009 21:59:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289514</guid>
		<description>There&#039;s an interesting jab in there about Australian academics rating Australian journals A+, which almost entirely misses the point.

In lots of disciplines, including economics, there are no genuinely international general journals (there are some in subfields like mathematical economics and econometrics). The leading general journal is the American Economic Review, and the runners-up are mostly house journals of US universities, followed by some UK journals. As far as applied work is concerned, these journals are (reasonably enough in one sense) parochial. The American Economic Review is much more likely to publish articles on US policy issues using US data than similar-quality articles about Australia.

So, if you want to applied work about Australia, you&#039;re going to spend a lot of time publishing in Australian journals. If this is to be rewarded in an output-based funding system, those journals have to be rated A+.

The difficulty is that only a minority of economic work is directly applied in this way, and the general standard of articles is consistent with the ranking that puts the American Economic Review at the top and its Australian equivalent (the Economic Record) nowhere. (There&#039;s also an Australian Economic Review, which sticks to good applied and policy pieces, and is very handy for those of us who like to mention a recent acceptance by AER!).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>There&#8217;s an interesting jab in there about Australian academics rating Australian journals A+, which almost entirely misses the point.</p>

	<p>In lots of disciplines, including economics, there are no genuinely international general journals (there are some in subfields like mathematical economics and econometrics). The leading general journal is the American Economic Review, and the runners-up are mostly house journals of US universities, followed by some UK journals. As far as applied work is concerned, these journals are (reasonably enough in one sense) parochial. The American Economic Review is much more likely to publish articles on US policy issues using US data than similar-quality articles about Australia.</p>

	<p>So, if you want to applied work about Australia, you&#8217;re going to spend a lot of time publishing in Australian journals. If this is to be rewarded in an output-based funding system, those journals have to be rated A+.</p>

	<p>The difficulty is that only a minority of economic work is directly applied in this way, and the general standard of articles is consistent with the ranking that puts the American Economic Review at the top and its Australian equivalent (the Economic Record) nowhere. (There&#8217;s also an Australian Economic Review, which sticks to good applied and policy pieces, and is very handy for those of us who like to mention a recent acceptance by <span class="caps">AER</span>!).</p>
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		<title>By: Ian</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289513</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Sep 2009 21:52:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289513</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;“Someone who takes a supervisor’s advice to base a career on writing about Slavoj Zizek is in the position of an investor deciding to invest in Bear Stearns on the advice of Lehman Brothers. ”

Nice!&lt;/i&gt;

As a quip, it&#039;s decent.  But does it describe a real state of affairs?  It seems to me that there are very few humanties scholars out there who &quot;base [their] career&quot; on theory of any sort, let alone one specific theorist.  In the past few years, the English department at my university, once a theory powerhouse, received funding for three hires in &quot;theory&quot; of some sort (as a way to regain some lost glory).  One remains unfilled, and the other two went to  people whose work on literature is theoretically inflected: in other words, ordinary literary scholars.  This is how most people in the humanities use theory, anyway: as a tool that helps them talk about the things they really want to talk about (which are rarely terrorism or the internet).

In broad terms, the article mostly takes what Bourdieu told us about the dynamics of fields a generation ago and dresses it up in the current financial crisis.  It&#039;s clever, but not nearly as clever as it thinks it is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>&#8220;Someone who takes a supervisor&#8217;s advice to base a career on writing about Slavoj Zizek is in the position of an investor deciding to invest in Bear Stearns on the advice of Lehman Brothers. &#8221;</i></p>

	<p>Nice!</p>

	<p>As a quip, it&#8217;s decent.  But does it describe a real state of affairs?  It seems to me that there are very few humanties scholars out there who &#8220;base [their] career&#8221; on theory of any sort, let alone one specific theorist.  In the past few years, the English department at my university, once a theory powerhouse, received funding for three hires in &#8220;theory&#8221; of some sort (as a way to regain some lost glory).  One remains unfilled, and the other two went to  people whose work on literature is theoretically inflected: in other words, ordinary literary scholars.  This is how most people in the humanities use theory, anyway: as a tool that helps them talk about the things they really want to talk about (which are rarely terrorism or the internet).</p>

	<p>In broad terms, the article mostly takes what Bourdieu told us about the dynamics of fields a generation ago and dresses it up in the current financial crisis.  It&#8217;s clever, but not nearly as clever as it thinks it is.</p>
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		<title>By: dsquared</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289512</link>
		<dc:creator>dsquared</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Sep 2009 21:47:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289512</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t have specific knowledge here, other than that most of the people I know in advertising are real Zizek fans, but having read &quot;The Desert of the Real&quot; in particular, it wouldn&#039;t at all surprise me that there&#039;s an influence there to the avalanche of reality television shows, revival of &quot;Come Dancing&quot;, etc.  Simon Cowell probably doesn&#039;t read Zizek, but the people who commission him might do, and Charlie Parsons (&quot;Survivor&quot; and others) was definitely a fan IIRC.  I&#039;d agree that this doesn&#039;t necessarily redeem the theory in intellectual terms, but was that Garrens&#039; point, or was it that media studies degrees would be worthless in practical terms?

(I&#039;m actually in favour of media studies even in the knowledge that most people who study it don&#039;t get a job in the media.  One of the critical factors in maintaining the UK as a global media hub is that we&#039;ve got a very discerning and sophisticated domestic market indeed.  It&#039;s kind of like having gastronomy on the curriculum in Lyons; the aim would be to perpetuate a regional cultural strength.  Adam Smith, iirc, claimed that the ins and outs of cutlery-making were practically normal conversation in public-houses in Sheffield, and I think there&#039;s a definite benefit in having conversations about irony, cultural appropriation and the social role of the media being standard pub-table fodder in Soho).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I don&#8217;t have specific knowledge here, other than that most of the people I know in advertising are real Zizek fans, but having read &#8220;The Desert of the Real&#8221; in particular, it wouldn&#8217;t at all surprise me that there&#8217;s an influence there to the avalanche of reality television shows, revival of &#8220;Come Dancing&#8221;, etc.  Simon Cowell probably doesn&#8217;t read Zizek, but the people who commission him might do, and Charlie Parsons (&#8220;Survivor&#8221; and others) was definitely a fan <span class="caps">IIRC</span>.  I&#8217;d agree that this doesn&#8217;t necessarily redeem the theory in intellectual terms, but was that Garrens&#8217; point, or was it that media studies degrees would be worthless in practical terms?</p>

	<p>(I&#8217;m actually in favour of media studies even in the knowledge that most people who study it don&#8217;t get a job in the media.  One of the critical factors in maintaining the UK as a global media hub is that we&#8217;ve got a very discerning and sophisticated domestic market indeed.  It&#8217;s kind of like having gastronomy on the curriculum in Lyons; the aim would be to perpetuate a regional cultural strength.  Adam Smith, iirc, claimed that the ins and outs of cutlery-making were practically normal conversation in public-houses in Sheffield, and I think there&#8217;s a definite benefit in having conversations about irony, cultural appropriation and the social role of the media being standard pub-table fodder in Soho).</p>
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		<title>By: Substance McGravitas</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289511</link>
		<dc:creator>Substance McGravitas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Sep 2009 21:39:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289511</guid>
		<description>If only we could go back to the time before the bubble when bullshit was readily identifiable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>If only we could go back to the time before the bubble when bullshit was readily identifiable.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Bertram</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289510</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Bertram</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Sep 2009 21:04:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289510</guid>
		<description>_lots of intelligent people in the media industry do actually regard Zizek (in particular) as having lots of useful things to say which help them continue to produce popular and profitable television programmes._

Hmm. Well a colleague in the a related discipline did once try the argument on me that academic research in cinema and tv is to actual (and lucrative) cultural production in those areas as medical research is to medicine. I didn&#039;t believe him though.

I&#039;d love to know, specifically, which remarks of Zizek&#039;s turned out to be practically useful in the way you describe ..... But even if you were to come up with them, I don&#039;t think it would establish what you need. After all, lots of genuinely great art has been produced under the influence of very dodgy theory in the past. It doesn&#039;t redeem the theory, as theory.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><em>lots of intelligent people in the media industry do actually regard Zizek (in particular) as having lots of useful things to say which help them continue to produce popular and profitable television programmes.</em></p>

	<p>Hmm. Well a colleague in the a related discipline did once try the argument on me that academic research in cinema and tv is to actual (and lucrative) cultural production in those areas as medical research is to medicine. I didn&#8217;t believe him though.</p>

	<p>I&#8217;d love to know, specifically, which remarks of Zizek&#8217;s turned out to be practically useful in the way you describe &#8230;.. But even if you were to come up with them, I don&#8217;t think it would establish what you need. After all, lots of genuinely great art has been produced under the influence of very dodgy theory in the past. It doesn&#8217;t redeem the theory, as theory.</p>
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		<title>By: engels</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289509</link>
		<dc:creator>engels</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Sep 2009 20:38:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289509</guid>
		<description>Actually it&#039;s a very even-handed article, from a Two Cultures point of view. Keep the humanities people happy by bashing fMRI and Ramachandran and keep the scientists happy by bashing Theory and Zizek.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Actually it&#8217;s a very even-handed article, from a Two Cultures point of view. Keep the humanities people happy by bashing fMRI and Ramachandran and keep the scientists happy by bashing Theory and Zizek.</p>
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		<title>By: engels</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289508</link>
		<dc:creator>engels</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Sep 2009 20:31:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289508</guid>
		<description>Theory-bashing also seems to a sector which is prone to over-investment in the UK...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Theory-bashing also seems to a sector which is prone to over-investment in the UK&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: mathpants</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289507</link>
		<dc:creator>mathpants</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Sep 2009 20:29:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289507</guid>
		<description>walt, that&#039;s pretty brilliant. I can only offer:

&quot;Duality or Dualities?&quot; and &quot;Love on the Chain Gang: Forbidden Contact Between Social Strata.&quot;

I&#039;ll get my coat.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>walt, that&#8217;s pretty brilliant. I can only offer:</p>

	<p>&#8220;Duality or Dualities?&#8221; and &#8220;Love on the Chain Gang: Forbidden Contact Between Social Strata.&#8221;</p>

	<p>I&#8217;ll get my coat.</p>
 ]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Walt</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289504</link>
		<dc:creator>Walt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Sep 2009 20:18:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289504</guid>
		<description>mathpants, you need to create your own media crisis.  I suggest titling your next paper &quot;Perverting the Sheaf: Towards a Transformative Hermeneutics of Intersectionality&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>mathpants, you need to create your own media crisis.  I suggest titling your next paper &#8220;Perverting the Sheaf: Towards a Transformative Hermeneutics of Intersectionality&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: dsquared</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/09/27/a-bubble-in-the-humanities/comment-page-1/#comment-289503</link>
		<dc:creator>dsquared</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Sep 2009 20:07:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13149#comment-289503</guid>
		<description>In actual fact, of course, the media industry is one of the UK&#039;s biggest export earners (and has the substantial advantage over financial services that it doesn&#039;t seem to require any &quot;bailouts&quot; above and beyond a modest TV licence fee), and lots of intelligent people in the media industry do actually regard Zizek (in particular) as having lots of useful things to say which help them continue to produce popular and profitable television programmes.  I&#039;ve always wondered why it seems to be taken as a given at the THES that Media Studies or Cultural Studies courses are useless in one of the world&#039;s biggest producers of media and culture; I occasionally wonder if the Swiss equivalent of the THES makes hilarious jokes about Watchmaking courses (I actually know that the Welsh language middlebrow press does, equally stupidly, have a prejudice against Tourism courses).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>In actual fact, of course, the media industry is one of the UK&#8217;s biggest export earners (and has the substantial advantage over financial services that it doesn&#8217;t seem to require any &#8220;bailouts&#8221; above and beyond a modest TV licence fee), and lots of intelligent people in the media industry do actually regard Zizek (in particular) as having lots of useful things to say which help them continue to produce popular and profitable television programmes.  I&#8217;ve always wondered why it seems to be taken as a given at the <span class="caps">THES</span> that Media Studies or Cultural Studies courses are useless in one of the world&#8217;s biggest producers of media and culture; I occasionally wonder if the Swiss equivalent of the <span class="caps">THES</span> makes hilarious jokes about Watchmaking courses (I actually know that the Welsh language middlebrow press does, equally stupidly, have a prejudice against Tourism courses).</p>
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