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	<title>Comments on: Doctor Who</title>
	<atom:link href="http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/</link>
	<description>Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing was ever made</description>
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		<title>By: Zeba</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-2/#comment-295761</link>
		<dc:creator>Zeba</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 12:41:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295761</guid>
		<description>I was a cusp Dr Who person, catching the last few Pertwee episodes, but mostly dominated by Baker as Who. Given that Dr Who was the only children&#039;s TV I was ever allowed to see at my school, I enjoyed it hugely, but I have much preferred modern Dr Who in terms of plot and characterisation. I enjoyed the storylines for the Eccleston Dr, but I didn&#039;t like Eccleston himself, who girned terribly. Tennant has been wonderful mainly because there is a really edgy darkness about his character, as those who saw this week&#039;s special The Water of Mars, will have encountered. Can&#039;t wait for Christmas specials with John Sims as the Master brought back.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I was a cusp Dr Who person, catching the last few Pertwee episodes, but mostly dominated by Baker as Who. Given that Dr Who was the only children&#8217;s <span class="caps">TV I</span> was ever allowed to see at my school, I enjoyed it hugely, but I have much preferred modern Dr Who in terms of plot and characterisation. I enjoyed the storylines for the Eccleston Dr, but I didn&#8217;t like Eccleston himself, who girned terribly. Tennant has been wonderful mainly because there is a really edgy darkness about his character, as those who saw this week&#8217;s special The Water of Mars, will have encountered. Can&#8217;t wait for Christmas specials with John Sims as the Master brought back.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-2/#comment-295728</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 04:29:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295728</guid>
		<description>Well, I&#039;ll ignore the jibe(s) about a favorite Doctor being an artifact of childhood, as I came to the show entirely unaware (oh happiest of channel surfing accidents) and discovered that Tom Baker Dr Who was the reason television was invented. Sylvester McCoy gets my second place nod.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Well, I&#8217;ll ignore the jibe(s) about a favorite Doctor being an artifact of childhood, as I came to the show entirely unaware (oh happiest of channel surfing accidents) and discovered that Tom Baker Dr Who was the reason television was invented. Sylvester McCoy gets my second place nod.</p>
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		<title>By: Timothy Burke</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-2/#comment-295571</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Burke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Nov 2009 20:35:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295571</guid>
		<description>Mart:

Just consider what the Tennant Doctor does to The Family of Blood in &quot;Human Nature&quot; &amp; &quot;The Family of Blood&quot;: he pretty much traps them in torments for all eternity, with an unmistakeably cruel and power-driven mood to that resolution. I think this has been a pretty consistent part of this characterization.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Mart:</p>

	<p>Just consider what the Tennant Doctor does to The Family of Blood in &#8220;Human Nature&#8221; &#038; &#8220;The Family of Blood&#8221;: he pretty much traps them in torments for all eternity, with an unmistakeably cruel and power-driven mood to that resolution. I think this has been a pretty consistent part of this characterization.</p>
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		<title>By: maidhc</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-2/#comment-295542</link>
		<dc:creator>maidhc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Nov 2009 05:23:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295542</guid>
		<description>The first Doctor I saw was Tom Baker, and the first episode I saw him in was his first episode, &quot;The Giant Robot&quot; (not one of the best).  He&#039;s still one of my favourite Doctors, and my other favourite from the first run was Sylvester McCoy, but unfortunately he didn&#039;t get enough time to really develop his character. I like the new shows, but since I only see them over the air in the US I&#039;m a couple of seasons behind.

I have seen every show still extant from the first series, and I still think that one of the very best single episodes was the very first show &quot;An Unearthly Child&quot; from 1963. Despite the dialogue and acting not being the best, it managed to achieve a truly creepy unsettling quality seldom equalled in later decades.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>The first Doctor I saw was Tom Baker, and the first episode I saw him in was his first episode, &#8220;The Giant Robot&#8221; (not one of the best).  He&#8217;s still one of my favourite Doctors, and my other favourite from the first run was Sylvester McCoy, but unfortunately he didn&#8217;t get enough time to really develop his character. I like the new shows, but since I only see them over the air in the <span class="caps">US I</span>&#8217;m a couple of seasons behind.</p>

	<p>I have seen every show still extant from the first series, and I still think that one of the very best single episodes was the very first show &#8220;An Unearthly Child&#8221; from 1963. Despite the dialogue and acting not being the best, it managed to achieve a truly creepy unsettling quality seldom equalled in later decades.</p>
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		<title>By: Sock Puppet of the Great Satan</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-2/#comment-295517</link>
		<dc:creator>Sock Puppet of the Great Satan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Nov 2009 15:48:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295517</guid>
		<description>&#039;I discover tonight via the Doctor Who News blog that, holy crap, Michael Moorcock is writing a Doctor Who novel, but “not a tie-in novel”.&#039;

Wow! The Doctor&#039;s going to get a &quot;Drain Soul&quot; attachment for his Sonic Screwdriver.

&quot;I can remember being really scared by the way the Dalek raygun zapped victims into negative. I guess that only works with B&amp;W.&quot;

I remember hiding behind the sofa for the Pertwee Giant Fly story (the Green Death, which I guess was around the time of Love Canal), and Planet of the Spiders. Scary Baker ones were the Ark of Space, Pyramids of Mars, Robots of Death, and Image of the Fendahl, and Robot. Thought the Key of Time cycle was awesome, and the Planet Makers (where everything was run by a corporation) great satire.

Odd thing is, the kid loves Doctor Who and the original Star Trek, even as I&#039;m wincing through the plot holes and crap special effects.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>&#8216;I discover tonight via the Doctor Who News blog that, holy crap, Michael Moorcock is writing a Doctor Who novel, but &#8220;not a tie-in novel&#8221;.&#8217;</p>

	<p>Wow! The Doctor&#8217;s going to get a &#8220;Drain Soul&#8221; attachment for his Sonic Screwdriver.</p>

	<p>&#8220;I can remember being really scared by the way the Dalek raygun zapped victims into negative. I guess that only works with B&#038;W.&#8221;</p>

	<p>I remember hiding behind the sofa for the Pertwee Giant Fly story (the Green Death, which I guess was around the time of Love Canal), and Planet of the Spiders. Scary Baker ones were the Ark of Space, Pyramids of Mars, Robots of Death, and Image of the Fendahl, and Robot. Thought the Key of Time cycle was awesome, and the Planet Makers (where everything was run by a corporation) great satire.</p>

	<p>Odd thing is, the kid loves Doctor Who and the original Star Trek, even as I&#8217;m wincing through the plot holes and crap special effects.</p>
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		<title>By: belle le triste</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-2/#comment-295508</link>
		<dc:creator>belle le triste</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Nov 2009 11:00:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295508</guid>
		<description>science fiction is the one kids&#039; genre where largescale death has always been acceptable: since the decline of the western anyway

one of the things i like about RTD is that he takes the present-day ultra-conundrum of &quot;watched by kids of all ages&quot; seriously as a nut to be cracked, even if his attempts to crack it often go rawther awry</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>science fiction is the one kids&#8217; genre where largescale death has always been acceptable: since the decline of the western anyway</p>

	<p>one of the things i like about <span class="caps">RTD</span> is that he takes the present-day ultra-conundrum of &#8220;watched by kids of all ages&#8221; seriously as a nut to be cracked, even if his attempts to crack it often go rawther awry</p>
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		<title>By: alex</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-2/#comment-295500</link>
		<dc:creator>alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Nov 2009 08:07:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295500</guid>
		<description>Meanwhile:  tiny robot suddenly grows rocket-propulsion after DW pokes it with sonic screwdriver = kids&#039; show! The fact that this can happen in the same episode as a major character shooting herself just to preserve a timeline opens interesting questions about what exactly &#039;kids&#039; are supposed to be thinking about all this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Meanwhile:  tiny robot suddenly grows rocket-propulsion after DW pokes it with sonic screwdriver = kids&#8217; show! The fact that this can happen in the same episode as a major character shooting herself just to preserve a timeline opens interesting questions about what exactly &#8216;kids&#8217; are supposed to be thinking about all this.</p>
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		<title>By: mart</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-2/#comment-295493</link>
		<dc:creator>mart</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Nov 2009 04:11:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295493</guid>
		<description>an undercurrent, yes, but I think a few episodes/ 1 series of him going a bit power-mad would have been an interesting conceit, instead of merely hinting a few times but not following through. Can&#039;t say I&#039;ll be too sorry to see Davis leave the show really - his scripts have always seemed overwrought.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>an undercurrent, yes, but I think a few episodes/ 1 series of him going a bit power-mad would have been an interesting conceit, instead of merely hinting a few times but not following through. Can&#8217;t say I&#8217;ll be too sorry to see Davis leave the show really &#8211; his scripts have always seemed overwrought.</p>
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		<title>By: mds</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-2/#comment-295484</link>
		<dc:creator>mds</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Nov 2009 02:47:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295484</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;but the different side shown by the Doctor at the end would have been better had it been introduced as a way forward earlier in the Tennant years, IMO.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Ahem.

&quot;Don&#039;t you think she looks tired?&quot;  (from &quot;The Christmas Invasion&quot;)

and,

&quot;&#039;Because sometimes you need someone to stop you.&quot;  (from &quot;The Runaway Bride&quot;)

And those are just a couple of examples.  Davies scripted it in too heavy-handed a manner, as has all-too-frequently been the case for him, but there&#039;s been an undercurrent of it all along.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><blockquote>but the different side shown by the Doctor at the end would have been better had it been introduced as a way forward earlier in the Tennant years, <span class="caps">IMO</span>.</blockquote></p>

	<p>Ahem.</p>

	<p>&#8220;Don&#8217;t you think she looks tired?&#8221;  (from &#8220;The Christmas Invasion&#8221;)</p>

	<p>and,</p>

	<p>&#8220;&#8217;Because sometimes you need someone to stop you.&#8221;  (from &#8220;The Runaway Bride&#8221;)</p>

	<p>And those are just a couple of examples.  Davies scripted it in too heavy-handed a manner, as has all-too-frequently been the case for him, but there&#8217;s been an undercurrent of it all along.</p>
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		<title>By: mart</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-2/#comment-295452</link>
		<dc:creator>mart</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 18:35:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295452</guid>
		<description>Did anyone else catch the new episode last night? I thought it was pretty good, but the different side shown by the Doctor at the end would have been better had it been introduced as a way forward earlier in the Tennant years, IMO.

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.guardian.co.uk/tv-and-radio/2009/nov/16/doctor-who-waters-mars-review&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Link to Guardian Review&lt;/a&gt; (contains spoilers).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Did anyone else catch the new episode last night? I thought it was pretty good, but the different side shown by the Doctor at the end would have been better had it been introduced as a way forward earlier in the Tennant years, <span class="caps">IMO</span>.</p>

	<p><a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/tv-and-radio/2009/nov/16/doctor-who-waters-mars-review" rel="nofollow">Link to Guardian Review</a> (contains spoilers).</p>
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		<title>By: hellblazer</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-1/#comment-295373</link>
		<dc:creator>hellblazer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Nov 2009 23:32:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295373</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;There’s also the fact that audiences are more familiar with the dominant story telling tropes.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Y&#039;know, I quite like the illusion that I&#039;m watching &lt;i&gt;characters&lt;/i&gt;, from time to time; it&#039;s the deviations from or riffs on the trope that are worth watching. Reducing &lt;i&gt;Die Hard&lt;/i&gt; to a list of its tropes rather diminishes the craft of that film, in my view. (Of course, there&#039;s good/enjoyable film-making that is almost &lt;i&gt;all&lt;/i&gt; tropes;  I&#039;m just trying to make the case that watching older things should be more than just going &quot;oh yes, Plot Device #163 on the list&quot;.)

And to be vaguely on topic: I have very little experience of pre 1980s televised DW, but presumably one will only get something out of it if one is willing, to some extent, to accept it on its own terms.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><blockquote>There&#8217;s also the fact that audiences are more familiar with the dominant story telling tropes.</blockquote></p>

	<p>Y&#8217;know, I quite like the illusion that I&#8217;m watching <i>characters</i>, from time to time; it&#8217;s the deviations from or riffs on the trope that are worth watching. Reducing <i>Die Hard</i> to a list of its tropes rather diminishes the craft of that film, in my view. (Of course, there&#8217;s good/enjoyable film-making that is almost <i>all</i> tropes;  I&#8217;m just trying to make the case that watching older things should be more than just going &#8220;oh yes, Plot Device #163 on the list&#8221;.)</p>

	<p>And to be vaguely on topic: I have very little experience of pre 1980s televised DW, but presumably one will only get something out of it if one is willing, to some extent, to accept it on its own terms.</p>
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		<title>By: hellblazer</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-1/#comment-295372</link>
		<dc:creator>hellblazer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Nov 2009 23:21:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295372</guid>
		<description>While the comment above about &quot;information per frame&quot; sounds plausible, I&#039;d just like to throw out the notion that some of the older stuff has less &lt;i&gt;stuff&lt;/i&gt; but more weight. You can argue that nothing much happens in any given 2-minute segment of &quot;Twelve Angry Men&quot;, but arguably a lot more is happening - in the viewer&#039;s imagination - than when Matt Damon throttles/strangles/asphyxiates in some way someone with a book. And I quite liked that Bourne movie; but it&#039;s just different, neither better nor worse than the filmed play that is TAM.

Compare Raging Bull with Goodfellas, for a less strained example perhaps.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>While the comment above about &#8220;information per frame&#8221; sounds plausible, I&#8217;d just like to throw out the notion that some of the older stuff has less <i>stuff</i> but more weight. You can argue that nothing much happens in any given 2-minute segment of &#8220;Twelve Angry Men&#8221;, but arguably a lot more is happening &#8211; in the viewer&#8217;s imagination &#8211; than when Matt Damon throttles/strangles/asphyxiates in some way someone with a book. And I quite liked that Bourne movie; but it&#8217;s just different, neither better nor worse than the filmed play that is <span class="caps">TAM</span>.</p>

	<p>Compare Raging Bull with Goodfellas, for a less strained example perhaps.</p>
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		<title>By: John Quiggin</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-1/#comment-295368</link>
		<dc:creator>John Quiggin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Nov 2009 22:21:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295368</guid>
		<description>I can remember being really scared by the way the Dalek raygun zapped victims into negative. I guess that only works with B&amp;W.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I can remember being really scared by the way the Dalek raygun zapped victims into negative. I guess that only works with B&#038;W.</p>
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		<title>By: Medrawt</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-1/#comment-295364</link>
		<dc:creator>Medrawt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Nov 2009 20:33:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295364</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not a scholar of either film or TV history, but actually I generally find that my attention span is most an issue not with stuff from the black and white era, but from the late 60s and 70s.  &lt;i&gt;Casablanca&lt;/i&gt; is good, &lt;i&gt;Mean Streets&lt;/i&gt; bores me (I know, I know, I&#039;m ducking the lightning bolt).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I&#8217;m not a scholar of either film or TV history, but actually I generally find that my attention span is most an issue not with stuff from the black and white era, but from the late 60s and 70s.  <i>Casablanca</i> is good, <i>Mean Streets</i> bores me (I know, I know, I&#8217;m ducking the lightning bolt).</p>
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		<title>By: belle le triste</title>
		<link>http://crookedtimber.org/2009/11/13/doctor-who/comment-page-1/#comment-295353</link>
		<dc:creator>belle le triste</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Nov 2009 17:20:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://crookedtimber.org/?p=13701#comment-295353</guid>
		<description>Today everything is available for re-viewing, and if you enjoyed it likely to  be multiply re-viewed, hence more detail can be packed in without risk -- there&#039;s far more detail in today&#039;s Who; lots of jokes and hints and foretastes that you&#039;ll only decode several episodes later: by contrast there&#039;s a swathe of early Doctor Who that has entirely vanished from the world, because it never occurred to the BBC that people would want to re-watch at some time; also there were a surprising number of &quot;nothing really happens&quot; episodes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Today everything is available for re-viewing, and if you enjoyed it likely to  be multiply re-viewed, hence more detail can be packed in without risk&#8212;there&#8217;s far more detail in today&#8217;s Who; lots of jokes and hints and foretastes that you&#8217;ll only decode several episodes later: by contrast there&#8217;s a swathe of early Doctor Who that has entirely vanished from the world, because it never occurred to the <span class="caps">BBC</span> that people would want to re-watch at some time; also there were a surprising number of &#8220;nothing really happens&#8221; episodes.</p>
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